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Episode IX: The Rise Of Skywalker - Discussion * SPOILER THREAD * — Page 18

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I remember hearing a rumor that Leia’s role in Ep9 would be to beckon Kylo Ren back to the light side of the force, that she would be his path to redemption.
With Carrie Fischer having left us, I wonder how it would work to still have that point be the thematic core of his arc, but to focus on her absence. At the end of TLJ, Kylo Ren is left empty and alone with a great deal of power. He decided to spare Leia from death when he had the chance early in the film, and the act of Rey closing the Falcon door on him to me spoke a message something to the effect of, “You are captive to the decisions you make, and you cannot count on others to hold out hope for you forever; there is a point at which it is too late.”

What if Ep9’s story related to Kylo Ren explores that idea? Part of Kylo assumed that Leia being alive would always allow for an “out,” but now she is gone and he is totally alone and self-absorbed. It could be a way to address Leia’s real-life absence in a thematically meaningful way, whether he is redeemed and/or dies or not.

My stance on revising fan edits.

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Hal 9000 said:

I remember hearing a rumor that Leia’s role in Ep9 would be to beckon Kylo Ren back to the light side of the force, that she would be his path to redemption.
With Carrie Fischer having left us, I wonder how it would work to still have that point be the thematic core of his arc, but to focus on her absence. At the end of TLJ, Kylo Ren is left empty and alone with a great deal of power. He decided to spare Leia from death when he had the chance early in the film, and the act of Rey closing the Falcon door on him to me spoke a message something to the effect of, “You are captive to the decisions you make, and you cannot count on others to hold out hope for you forever; there is a point at which it is too late.”

What if Ep9’s story related to Kylo Ren explores that idea? Part of Kylo assumed that Leia being alive would always allow for an “out,” but now she is gone and he is totally alone and self-absorbed. It could be a way to address Leia’s real-life absence in a thematically meaningful way, whether he is redeemed and/or dies or not.

I’ve had similar thoughts. It is a true shame that we’ll never have a scene of them together, but there is still a way to delve into that relationship. If Leia dies before a face to face encounter with Kylo, I could easily see how that might impact Ben emotionally in ways he didn’t expect. The lack of closure there could be a powerful motivator in making him realize the emptiness and loneliness that he has in his position with the First Order on the dark side.

I’ve probably said it here before, but if Kylo’s going to turn to the good, he’s going to have to be proactive and do it himself. The Vader method of Luke meeting up and lending a hand hasn’t worked, we’ve seen Han, Rey, and Luke (kinda) make that effort with him, and he’s rejected. They can’t keep trying, if Ben’s going to go that way, he’s the one who’s going to have to put that effort in, and he’s going to have to see for himself that that’s what he really wants.

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Just because we won’t SEE Leia, doesn’t mean we won’t HEAR her talk to her son. I’m hoping that they put something together using existing audio of Carrie Fisher as Leia to give Ben that emotional farewell to her son.

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There is no redemption. He needs to die like a dog. He murdered his father. He murdered his mentor. He murdered all of his fellow students. He attempted to murder his uncle. He either needs to win and the trilogy ends on down note or he needs to die.

I don’t see any reasonable way he can turn to the light and survive. He was part of the murder of an entire system.

The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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I don’t see them ending this like Return of the Jedi, that’s bad writing right there, no originality at all.

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CarboniteSolo said:

I don’t see them ending this like Return of the Jedi, that’s bad writing right there, no originality at all.

But don’t you remember? TFA was a remake of Star Wars. JJ Abrams is a hack! He’ll probably copy ewoks and have swarms of porgs kill storm troopers by throwing pebbles with there wings!

TV’s Frink said:

I would put this in my sig if I weren’t so lazy.

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Hardcore Legend said:

There is no redemption. He needs to die like a dog. He murdered his father. He murdered his mentor. He murdered all of his fellow students. He attempted to murder his uncle. He either needs to win and the trilogy ends on down note or he needs to die.

I don’t see any reasonable way he can turn to the light and survive. He was part of the murder of an entire system.

You’re almost 35 years too late.

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I think he and others have read the reviews for The Force Awakens, they know what not to do now, at least I hope so.

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CarboniteSolo said:

I think he and others have read the reviews for The Force Awakens, they know what not to do now, at least I hope so.

To be honest their chances of rehashing the OT are much smaller. They already rehashed SW and a few bits of TESB in TFA and TESB and RotJ in TLJ.

So naturally it’s time to rehash the prequels.

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GZK8000 said:

Hardcore Legend said:

There is no redemption. He needs to die like a dog. He murdered his father. He murdered his mentor. He murdered all of his fellow students. He attempted to murder his uncle. He either needs to win and the trilogy ends on down note or he needs to die.

I don’t see any reasonable way he can turn to the light and survive. He was part of the murder of an entire system.

You’re almost 35 years too late.

Is this in reference to Vader? Because his death was part of his redemption. There is no logistical way he could have survived and returned with Luke to the Rebels.

Also, I don’t think we actually saw Vader kill any Rebels in the OT. Kylo ordered the murder of an innocent village of people in TFA. He’s gotta die or win.

The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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Hardcore Legend said:

Also, I don’t think we actually saw Vader kill any Rebels in the OT. Kylo ordered the murder of an innocent village of people in TFA. He’s gotta die or win.

That’s right. Instead he sent anonymous soldiers to die for him, only entering the Tantiv once the rebel threat had been neutralized.

Oh, and he went out as a fighter pilot and shot down rebel ships.

TV’s Frink said:

I would put this in my sig if I weren’t so lazy.

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CHEWBAKAspelledwrong said:

Hardcore Legend said:

Also, I don’t think we actually saw Vader kill any Rebels in the OT. Kylo ordered the murder of an innocent village of people in TFA. He’s gotta die or win.

That’s right. Instead he sent anonymous soldiers to die for him, only entering the Tantiv once the rebel threat had been neutralized.

Oh, and he went out as a fighter pilot and shot down rebel ships.

Right, which still wasn’t good but was all reasonable things to do in a war. Which is also why he needed to die.

After rewatching TFA last night, the lack of time jump really bothers me when it comes to Kylo/Rey. Basically, in the span of 3 days she goes from watching him murder Han and mame her friend, hating him so much that she slices his face open and wants him to die to thinking it would be OK if he came back to the lightside with her and help the resistance. Just 4 days before that he ordered an entire village of resistance sympathizers executed and oversaw the anhiliataion of an entire system.

The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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I want to see Kylo lose his connection to the Force, like in the old Tales of the Jedi comics. Then he is hated by the Resistance, the remnants of the FO and basically everyone forcing him to steal the Falcon and retreat into the underworld of the galaxy. With the possibility that he knocked Rey up so we can have 10-12 if they decide to go that far.

Oh and C-3PO is destroyed because could we ever accept anyone other than Anthony Daniels in the role? He’s over 70 and this will probably be his last time in the costume.

It seems like people are really embracing the new characters. In fact, the big question people ask me now about Star Wars is, “Are Finn and Poe gay lovers?” And really how the f*ck would I know? My second husband left me for a man, so my gaydar isn’t exactly what you’d call Death Star level quality. ----Carrie Fisher

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lovelikewinter said:

I want to see Kylo lose his connection to the Force, like in the old Tales of the Jedi comics. Then he is hated by the Resistance, the remnants of the FO and basically everyone forcing him to steal the Falcon and retreat into the underworld of the galaxy. With the possibility that he knocked Rey up so we can have 10-12 if they decide to go that far.

Oh and C-3PO is destroyed because could we ever accept anyone other than Anthony Daniels in the role? He’s over 70 and this will probably be his last time in the costume.

3PO should’ve been behind the controls when the cruiser Kamikaze’d Snoke’s ship. He’s been nothing but in the frame on occasion b/c he has to be. Would’ve been a nice way to make his character important to the ST.

TV’s Frink said:

I would put this in my sig if I weren’t so lazy.

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 (Edited)

I don’t think protocol droids are programmed for that sort of thing. And even if you count Episode III, Threepio’s piloting skills probabaly got flushed along with all his other memories.
I think in the end Threepio and even Artoo are the witnesses to history who pass these stories on. Daniels can teach a replacement to wear the suit, (as has been done with Chewie) and do the voice a bit longer.

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Where were you in '77?

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Killing Threepio would be the worst thing that could ever happen in a Star Wars movie.

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DominicCobb said:

Vader was a much worse person.

In the OT? Nah.

After we have his backstory fleshed out, yes. The poor younglings!

The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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DominicCobb said:

Killing Threepio would be the worst thing that could ever happen in a Star Wars movie.

I would like, if possible, for one last film where C3PO, R2, Chewie are vital supporting characters to our lead. Let’s go look for Lando, Kylo’s real father!

The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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DominicCobb said:

Hardcore Legend said:

DominicCobb said:

Vader was a much worse person.

In the OT? Nah.

After we have his backstory fleshed out, yes. The poor younglings!

Yes in the OT. Sorry that you like Han Solo more than Obi-wan.

He didn’t kill Obi-Wan

Also, Obi Wan had a weapon and they were in a fair fight. Han was murdered.

The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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Hardcore Legend said:

DominicCobb said:

Killing Threepio would be the worst thing that could ever happen in a Star Wars movie.

I would like, if possible, for one last film where C3PO, R2, Chewie are vital supporting characters to our lead.

They haven’t been since the OT. I think we just gotta accept that. Though I would argue that Chewie in TFA has a fairly sizeable role (and he’ll be big in Solo!).

Let’s go look for Lando, Kylo’s real father!

I am hoping they fit Lando in IX somewhere.

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DominicCobb said:

Hardcore Legend said:

DominicCobb said:

Hardcore Legend said:

DominicCobb said:

Vader was a much worse person.

In the OT? Nah.

After we have his backstory fleshed out, yes. The poor younglings!

Yes in the OT. Sorry that you like Han Solo more than Obi-wan.

He didn’t kill Obi-Wan

Um, what?

Darth Vader did not kill Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan became one with the Force before the blow was struck.

The Jedi are all but extinct.......
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 (Edited)

Hardcore Legend said:

DominicCobb said:

Hardcore Legend said:

DominicCobb said:

Hardcore Legend said:

DominicCobb said:

Vader was a much worse person.

In the OT? Nah.

After we have his backstory fleshed out, yes. The poor younglings!

Yes in the OT. Sorry that you like Han Solo more than Obi-wan.

He didn’t kill Obi-Wan

Um, what?

Darth Vader did not kill Obi-Wan. Obi-Wan became one with the Force before the blow was struck.

That’s a frankly ridiculous hair to split that has essentially no bearing on this conversation whatsoever.