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So why Define STAR WARS as OT OR PT? — Page 2

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I say it's eye candy except for the very end. That's a nice explanation of the lightsaber twirl, but that wasn't my main problem with it. For me, it just seemed like the lava overshadowed the characters. The first time I saw it, that duel was the only part where I just blanked out and couldn't help not paying attention. It was hard for me to pay attention the second time as well. Yes, I knew it had been planned as a lava/volcano duel for years (one of the few details that has a long-standing precedent attached to it), but there was simply too much. I couldn't concentrate on the characters there was so much of it, and this was a duel that I felt really should have been more character-driven rather than effects-driven. That is why the duel in Empire is my favorite. It is a huge step-up from the Ben/Vader fight. It is much more rugged and intense, and the focus stays on the characters. And the part where they are on the hover-droids inches from the lava is just ridiculous in my opinion. There is no way they could be that close to the lava and not get burnt by at least some of the particles flying by, especially when Vader gets burnt up by it just a few minutes later. That was where I was convinced it had gone too far. But once they stopped fighting and started talking, that's when it brought me back, and I began to appreciate it.

There is no lingerie in space…

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don’t exist… then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks… and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming… Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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My Favorite Saber Fights go in this Order.


1. Episodes 3's Yoda/Emperor & ObiWan/AniVader (I count that as 1 saber fight, since they happen at the same time)

2. Luke Vs. Vader in Episode 5

And #3 was hard to pick over Mace vs. Palpatine (Mace Windu has became my favorite character) and The Darth Maul fight.

3. Episode 1's Darth Maul/ ObiWan & Qui Gon



EDIT: I can be called the Bill O'Reilly of STAR WARS (Even though I am Liberal)

I like to remove the spin on things that Fans and Haters like to put on STAR WARS, and Interpret things the way I see them and hear Lucas say/do.
Jar Jar Binks: If me be returnin, the Bosses will do terrible things to me! Tewwwwible things!
Qui-Gon Jinn: Do you hear that?
[a rumbling is heard in the distance]
Jar Jar Binks: Yeah.
Qui-Gon Jinn: That is the sound of a thousand terrible things headed this way.
Obi-Wan: If they find us, they will crush us, grind us into TINY pieces and BLAST us into oblivion!
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I would like to take this discussion into another discussion.

If Lucas is to do a "final" edit in 2007, I say he at least does this.




Everything is the way it was in the 2004 edit

But with Color corrections, betterquality of picture (u can still kind of tell it looks out dated, I think Lowry held back and only cleaned it up 1/4 of what they are gonna do in the 30th anniversary purposely so the anniversary would look nice and have lots of people who are fans of episodes 1 - 3 go buy it)

Episode 4 has more music (John Williams is the best music composer next to Howard Shore)

Possible scene in Episode 4 with Palpatine disolving the senate on Coruscant (it would be a short scene, so if he could do it with as little CGI...that would be great because I know the nerdy fans would flame this great film to no end if it had tons of CGI, I would like to see CGI though)

Flame me all you want for this one...but I wanna see Qui Gon at least. If your gonna have HC..why not throw in Qui Gons crazy ass..now its a party. After all...Qui Gon did trigger alot of this stuff in STAR WARS.


In Episodes 1, 2, 3, 5, 6 Either add a Puppet Yoda to all scenes (of course except the fighting scenes) or a CGI Yoda. I want Lucas to stick with 1 version of yoda that seems to AGE over the course of thing, not look old, young, old. If he wants to use his Mitichlorion BS..then use the CGI yoda. Using CGI is alot easier to chage dialogue with, than with a puppet (DUH) And possibly add Talk of Qui Gon or Mace or something.

ROTJ Should end showing the JEDI Ghost after it shows the rebels and landos absurred clapping dance, since the series did start with them.

Episode 4 could also use some CGI X-Wings and Tie Fighters in the big space battle of the death star (Not for the take off or approach, that is too classic, but in the background at least)


Episodes 1 and 2 should have every deleted scene integrated into them and episode 3 should add scenes with ObiWan and Anakin acting like friends at the beginning parts.

STAR WARS Would be complete IMHO And George Lucas would have no need to change them ever again.
Jar Jar Binks: If me be returnin, the Bosses will do terrible things to me! Tewwwwible things!
Qui-Gon Jinn: Do you hear that?
[a rumbling is heard in the distance]
Jar Jar Binks: Yeah.
Qui-Gon Jinn: That is the sound of a thousand terrible things headed this way.
Obi-Wan: If they find us, they will crush us, grind us into TINY pieces and BLAST us into oblivion!
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Originally posted by: Hardcore Legend
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Originally posted by: fans own the trilogy
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Originally posted by: Hardcore Legend
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Originally posted by: fans own the trilogy
If GL really cared about the fans he should have at least watched the OT before he started on the PT, all GL cares about is pushing the merchandising, while we all fight over which is better the PT or the OT. Oh, and Welcome to the boards!!!


If that were the case, he would have fleeced you already for the OOT DVDs.


I didn't buy the toys, lunchboxes and such then and I'm sure not buying them now, all I want is the OT on DVD. If you like being fleeced on the new crap go ahead.



What?


Exactly.
"Drink the Kool-Aid. Wear blinders. Cover your ears. Because that's the only way you can totally enjoy Revenge of the Sith -- the final and most futile attempt from skilled producer, clumsy director and tin-eared writer George Lucas to create a prequel trilogy to match the myth-making spirit of the original Star Wars saga he unleashed twenty-eight years ago. Fan boys, of course, have convinced themselves otherwise. So have several critics, if you go by early reviews."
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I'm not here to try to change anyone's oppinion. Just to state some facts.

Tony:

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Greedo shooting first adds more to Han Solo's badass feel (please bare with me yet again)
Han never flinches, so it shows how calm and cool he is and then shoots right away at Greedo. Greedo Misses his first shot, Han does not. This shows Han being the better of the 2.

Actually, if you look at all three versions. You find that in SE not only does he flinch. His whole body moves! In an impossible way of looking like a cut-out and, moving entirely by a few inches. In the DVD only his head moves still in an impossible way. In the original he doesn't move.

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Showing Jabba early on in the series in Episode 4...is not taking the suprise away from what Jabba is a silly statement. Jabba is shown in Episode 1 and has to be. Jabba runs most of that area of Tatooine, and it is natural for him to be seen at the Pod Race. Having Jabba in episode 4 is a good thing IMHO.

How is it a good thing in your oppinion(Jabba in ANH)?

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Episode 4 had very little music and it just seems so very bland too me, but I love it none the less...just I would watch it last to the other STAR WARS Films.

If you've only watched the 2004 DVD english track yes. If you've seen SE or, the original you would have heard more music. Why? Well, in 2004 DVD the force fanfare has been minimized. Click here for more info and, go to audio changes You can hear it if you change to the french track in the beginning of the fight though.


http://twister111.tumblr.com
Previous Signature preservation link

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Tony, I became a fan around the same time you did, and I find I share many of your viewpoints. I too find the original film trilogy to be highly overrated (especially Jedi now that I'm older) and the the prequel films should be considered more.
However, the posters of this forum do make as many good points. They will probably just have to live with the newer films and treat them the way most treat the Expanded Universe stories.
I have a few ideas for fan edits (though currently I don't have the technology, much less the time, nor experience to pull it off).
One of an isolated original trilogy (probably edited DOWN from the upcoming final edits mixed with previous cuts) to include the more desirable special effects while restoring the original revelation of the Falcon (Jabba is too gangsta to get stepped on like one guy pointed out), Han's blast, original sarlacc (the new one bugs me! was that in the SE? I don't remember), and the original Anakin. You know, the "aint broke" stuff.
The second a 6-film would include these same changes, with the inclusion of deleted scenes from the prequelsminus a few cheap giggles from Jarjar (the poo-butt joke, the "my tongue" bit, and boss nass' floppy cheeks) and some of lil' Annie's dialog (this is pod racing, yippee, it's working, oops... goddamn Jake Lloyd).

Actually, these edits are so minor that I'm confused why George Lucas wouldnt have fixed these silly silly things by now, but he probably won't. We'll see how it turns out. Hopefully Lucas will do SOMETHING to fit the movies together, and have the sense to make the ANH jabba scene a bonus rather than to exist in the film).

To Tony, as much as you accuse the old school fans of holding on too tightly to their childhood, you seem to protect George's "True Star Wars Story" with as much passion. I like to keep in mind that the Star Wars universe is subject to endless imagination. Nothing in Star Wars has ever been official, and I'm sure that even after the 30th Anniversary, we'll find continuity disaggreements, not to mention bad acting and mistakes. BTW, did they ever fix the mirror-image Boba Fett?
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I am quite aware of the MIX of the 2004 force fanfare on the attack of the death star scene. It is not the end of the film that bothers me, just the first 40 MIN. Also some scenes with Vader and Tarkin that could have used some dreaded evil style John Williams music.

I think Jake Lloyd played Anakin well. You see this nice kid, and when he falls to darth vader...it is much more Tragic. You know he could have been good, you knew he could have been nice, he yeleld "Yippee!!!" he was happy...now look at him, just a puppet of evil with no heart and is more machine than man.


As for Jabba, well the suprise thing is done since you meet him in Episode 1. You get to See Jabba in Episode 4 and know who this guy is and why he is after Solo in episode 4. He tells Solo "I will put a price so big on your head, every bounty hunter in the universe will be after you" and is that not what him and Vader do? I think the scene also adds to Solo's badass factor (Lets be honest, Jabba is a worm...so do not even justify him being a badass...he has baddass's do his "badass" work for him)


They should add every scene in Episode 1 except for the waterfall scene (it is the only Jar Jar deleted scene) so it would add more time without Jar Jar. I personally have no Problem with JarJar, but that would please many people and that would be a good thing. Jar Jar fans get to keep their JarJar and JarJar haters get to get more time without him.

Episode 2 should show the deleetd scenes with Anakin and Padme at her house. It will Add more to their love and make it more tragic when ti ends, as well as the other deleted scenes.


I really hope he adds the Greedo Scene in Episode 1. It will show Anakin being bad at least once in Episode 1, and be a funny thing to have since Greedo does meet a "Bad End" like it is told to him in Episode 1.

Now that we are talking about Greedo, Solo flinching or not, it still makes him a badass. It shows he can move his head as easily as that! and BAM! End Greedos Pathetic life that failed at killing solo a first try, and solo kills him a first try.



I would not call the way I approach STAR WARS "Passion" at all. I only take the movies for what they are and what they are/will become. Instead of holding onto memories, I build new ones.
Jar Jar Binks: If me be returnin, the Bosses will do terrible things to me! Tewwwwible things!
Qui-Gon Jinn: Do you hear that?
[a rumbling is heard in the distance]
Jar Jar Binks: Yeah.
Qui-Gon Jinn: That is the sound of a thousand terrible things headed this way.
Obi-Wan: If they find us, they will crush us, grind us into TINY pieces and BLAST us into oblivion!
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Your generalizing too much Tony. And the beauty of it is you haven't changed anyones mind.
"Drink the Kool-Aid. Wear blinders. Cover your ears. Because that's the only way you can totally enjoy Revenge of the Sith -- the final and most futile attempt from skilled producer, clumsy director and tin-eared writer George Lucas to create a prequel trilogy to match the myth-making spirit of the original Star Wars saga he unleashed twenty-eight years ago. Fan boys, of course, have convinced themselves otherwise. So have several critics, if you go by early reviews."
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Did I once come here stating I wished to change peoples mind? I am only bringing ideas, thoughts, opinions to the table. If you have this thing that anybody who is not here to agree with you must be here to change peopels minds, well then you should change your user name to "Paranoid fans own the trilogy"
Jar Jar Binks: If me be returnin, the Bosses will do terrible things to me! Tewwwwible things!
Qui-Gon Jinn: Do you hear that?
[a rumbling is heard in the distance]
Jar Jar Binks: Yeah.
Qui-Gon Jinn: That is the sound of a thousand terrible things headed this way.
Obi-Wan: If they find us, they will crush us, grind us into TINY pieces and BLAST us into oblivion!
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Originally posted by: Tony
Did I once come here stating I wished to change peoples mind? I am only bringing ideas, thoughts, opinions to the table. If you have this thing that anybody who is not here to agree with you must be here to change peopels minds, well then you should change your user name to "Paranoid fans own the trilogy"


I actually like that name. Yeah but your bringing the same ideas and thoughts that have already been mentioned a thousand times before, why not just go TFN everyone loves the whole saga there. This forum is to bring back the original trilogy to DVD unaltered, so why come here and ask "why doesn't everybody like the PT?" And all your ideas on how the changes make this "badass" and that "better" make we want to vomit. Oh, and welcome to the board!
"Drink the Kool-Aid. Wear blinders. Cover your ears. Because that's the only way you can totally enjoy Revenge of the Sith -- the final and most futile attempt from skilled producer, clumsy director and tin-eared writer George Lucas to create a prequel trilogy to match the myth-making spirit of the original Star Wars saga he unleashed twenty-eight years ago. Fan boys, of course, have convinced themselves otherwise. So have several critics, if you go by early reviews."
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I am a STAR WARS Fan, I am entitled to be a fan of Episodes 4 - 6. I have every right to post my opinions here, and I am quite aware that my opinions have been mentioned countless times by others, but I am here to bring them into discussion with episodes 4 - 6 in mind. (If you have not noticed, I will never say Prequel Trilogy or Original Trilogy because I do not believe in those terms in STAR WARS)
Jar Jar Binks: If me be returnin, the Bosses will do terrible things to me! Tewwwwible things!
Qui-Gon Jinn: Do you hear that?
[a rumbling is heard in the distance]
Jar Jar Binks: Yeah.
Qui-Gon Jinn: That is the sound of a thousand terrible things headed this way.
Obi-Wan: If they find us, they will crush us, grind us into TINY pieces and BLAST us into oblivion!
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Han isn't really dodging that blast easily. If you notice, he takes his endless badass essence and conjurs up a computer-generated action, and then he smokes Greedo. I liked it when the screen filled with sparks and gave us a Fried Green Rodian. Just a personal preference. If I make any edits of the trilogy, I'd get rid of this ridiculous and pointless special effect, as well as Jthe cruddy-looking Jabba scene.

Also, Jabba's appearance in Episode one really doesn't exist to many folks here. To some of us, Epsisode 1 doesnt exist. To others, we rely on MagFan's talents to deliver the good edits.

PS: I also like the deleted scenes in the prequels. I actually like Jarjar's waterfall sequence, but I'm not sure why! Heck, I even like Jarjar, just not his goofy "tongue" scenes.

Hey, I watched the original Star Wars three times tonight. I'm a sick person like everybody else now!
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Originally posted by: Tony
I will never say Prequel Trilogy or Original Trilogy

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Originally posted by: Tony
Prequel Trilogy... Original Trilogy

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Originally posted by: Tony
I am not here to provoke any type of flame war, just intelligent conversation. I notice that STAR WARS Fans use terms such as PT or OT to define the films. I think if we all just start calling STAR WARS....just that, what it reall is (STAR WARS) and not "PT THAT SUCKS BECAUSE OF THE CGI" or "OT RULES BECAUSE I GREW UP WITH IT" Then it will be easier to keep STAR WARS As a whole.


I think that George Lucas does the things he does, like change the OOT To this new film, because he deep down cares about the fans (bare with me)

He wants to connect the OOT fans with the PT and bring STAR WARS Together as a whole. Maybe if us fans, the ones who made STAR WARS Such a great success that it is today, quit being selficious and dislike the films for legit reasons and quit acting as if they are in a different universe (PT AND OT) then maybe we can all enjoy STAR WARS Alot more.

Sure owning the OOT on DVD would be a nice thing for George Lucas to do, but it is not the end of STAR WARS if he does not. We grew up on the OOT (some of us) and I Think it is time for us to let the New generation, and generations to come, enjoy STAR WARS. STAR WARS are great films, and if you really believe STAR WARS Is great, you will not leta few adjustments that "rape your childhood" get in the way of it being a great Series.

If you hate Episode 1 because of Jar Jar binks, chances are that you are an adult...and that is natural. If you hate it because it does not Have Vader, Luke, or Solo...then that is just silly.

As for HC being in Episode 6...if you were any type of STAR WARS Fan, you would know that when a Jedi Becomes a sith, he dies both Spiritually and Physically (IE The Eyes and color of skin)

Greedo shooting first adds more to Han Solo's badass feel (please bare with me yet again)
Han never flinches, so it shows how calm and cool he is and then shoots right away at Greedo. Greedo Misses his first shot, Han does not. This shows Han being the better of the 2.


Showing Jabba early on in the series in Episode 4...is not taking the suprise away from what Jabba is a silly statement. Jabba is shown in Episode 1 and has to be. Jabba runs most of that area of Tatooine, and it is natural for him to be seen at the Pod Race. Having Jabba in episode 4 is a good thing IMHO.


Bash this, Flame me, all you want. But I am a STAR WARS Fan, not an OT fan, or a PT fan.


all i can say is that you spoke exactly what has been on my mind from the begining. all i can say is i agree with you completely. its funny cause on this site i migh thave gotten peged by all the new comers that i am an PT fan because i am always defending it. the fact is that i like all of starwars, and the funny thing is i like some of the books more then the movies, i find they have so much more to offer, and there not as sloppy. i.e. things are quite clearly explained and you don't get people getting mad about something that doesnt make sense to them right away.

theres too much reading to go through here right now so forgive me.
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Originally posted by: Tony
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The first 40 min. to me could have used more music (mainly the droid sequences) But that is just me being a Film Director of the future, not a fan. As a Fan I will take STAR WARS For whatever way George Lucas gives it to me, it is his films and I will accept that.


Well, it's a tricky matter, you add too much music to a scene and it can take away, or vice versa. Take away the Jaws theme music, then you're left with an empty scene, use it too much and it looses its effectiveness.

Or for example, I'm a big fan of the Japanese version of DBZ, but the American dub has taken away some of the drama by playing music NONSTOP. Tense stare downs, where you hear only the russle of wind in the background, are now replaced and dimnished by nonstop synthesizers playing in the background, loosing the intense build up before a battle.

You have to find a happy balance.

I think the Star Wars music is just fine. John Williams in a friggin' genious.



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Originally posted by: Tony
(If you have not noticed, I will never say Prequel Trilogy or Original Trilogy because I do not believe in those terms in STAR WARS)


Thats fine, and if you haven't noticed I will never acknowledge the PT as a part of Star Wars, ever.
"Drink the Kool-Aid. Wear blinders. Cover your ears. Because that's the only way you can totally enjoy Revenge of the Sith -- the final and most futile attempt from skilled producer, clumsy director and tin-eared writer George Lucas to create a prequel trilogy to match the myth-making spirit of the original Star Wars saga he unleashed twenty-eight years ago. Fan boys, of course, have convinced themselves otherwise. So have several critics, if you go by early reviews."
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Shimraa it is good to see a STAR WARS Fan that still exist.

Fans Own The Trilogy you are not a fan.

You are an Episodes 4 - 6 Fan Boy.
Jar Jar Binks: If me be returnin, the Bosses will do terrible things to me! Tewwwwible things!
Qui-Gon Jinn: Do you hear that?
[a rumbling is heard in the distance]
Jar Jar Binks: Yeah.
Qui-Gon Jinn: That is the sound of a thousand terrible things headed this way.
Obi-Wan: If they find us, they will crush us, grind us into TINY pieces and BLAST us into oblivion!
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LOL!
"Drink the Kool-Aid. Wear blinders. Cover your ears. Because that's the only way you can totally enjoy Revenge of the Sith -- the final and most futile attempt from skilled producer, clumsy director and tin-eared writer George Lucas to create a prequel trilogy to match the myth-making spirit of the original Star Wars saga he unleashed twenty-eight years ago. Fan boys, of course, have convinced themselves otherwise. So have several critics, if you go by early reviews."
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*EDIT*

Looks like Gaffer Tape already posted it. Just to make things clear, they are not ALL my opinions. They are also opinions and ideas I've collected over the years from Star Wars fans. I just happen to agree with them.

Tony, if you want my opinions on PT and AofC, go here:

http://www.originaltrilogy.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=2&threadid=987&STARTPAGE=24

People are now labeled "fan-boys" if they have an opinion on the prequels, and simply don't like them as films. Just like you're flooding us with your opinions, we do have our own. It's just that some people are over it already, like myself. This is all I'm going to say about it, quite honesly I'm sick of this prequels V.S. orignals debate, or how people would improve/do things different etc. etc. It just gets very old and tiresome.
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Originally posted by: Tony
Shimraa it is good to see a STAR WARS Fan that still exist.

Fans Own The Trilogy you are not a fan.

You are an Episodes 4 - 6 Fan Boy.



Don't know why i call Star Wars (1977), Episode IV - A New Hope now????
"A Jedi can feel the force flow through him".
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Originally posted by: Tony
Shimraa it is good to see a STAR WARS Fan that still exist.

Fans Own The Trilogy you are not a fan.

You are an Episodes 4 - 6 Fan Boy.


This is a pretty ridiculous statement. You don't have to like all of the works in a volume to be a fan. Take, for example, the Beatles. I'm just not that fond of Let It Be. Just doesn't really do anything for me. I love Please Please Me, Meet the Beatles, Rubber Soul, Sgt Pepper and all the rest, but just not really Let It Be. That mean's I'm not a Beatles fan? Hell no it doesn't, it just means that of all of their output, I would prefer to listen to Let It Be the least.

That being said, I would like to point out that I am a fan of the entire Star Wars series, both the old and the new, albeit two of the new ones hold the bottom two spots on my list. I merely had to point out how nonsensical your statement regarding "fandom" is.

I used to be very active on this forum. I’m not really anymore. Sometimes, people still want to get in touch with me about something, and that is great! If that describes you, please email me at [my username]ATgmailDOTcom.

Hi everybody. You’re all awesome. Keep up the good work.

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Originally posted by: Seiji
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Originally posted by: Tony
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The first 40 min. to me could have used more music (mainly the droid sequences) But that is just me being a Film Director of the future, not a fan. As a Fan I will take STAR WARS For whatever way George Lucas gives it to me, it is his films and I will accept that.


Well, it's a tricky matter, you add too much music to a scene and it can take away, or vice versa. Take away the Jaws theme music, then you're left with an empty scene, use it too much and it looses its effectiveness.

Or for example, I'm a big fan of the Japanese version of DBZ, but the American dub has taken away some of the drama by playing music NONSTOP. Tense stare downs, where you hear only the russle of wind in the background, are now replaced and dimnished by nonstop synthesizers playing in the background, loosing the intense build up before a battle.

You have to find a happy balance.

I think the Star Wars music is just fine. John Williams in a friggin' genious.


I agree with you totally Seiji. I'm a DBZ fan, and one of the reasons I hate the US version (and I don't have to enjoy all version of DBZ to consider myself a fan; I just enjoy the original) is the constant use of music. And I hope you don't mind that I posted your list of reasons. I made sure to give you credit beforehand.

There is no lingerie in space…

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don’t exist… then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks… and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming… Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.

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Fuck me Gaffer man. I've just read your post from page one, and man you can fucking talk!

Took me fucking ages to read that shit, man.
I'll read the rest of this thread in a minute, but I just wanted to say now, that Fuck me man, you really don't like TPM.

Man!

http://www.facebook.com/DirtyWookie

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Originally posted by: Hardcore Legend
Like oojason said, the Star Wars 'trilogy' for me now is ROTS, SW and ESB. If I was to show a child the films for the first time, I do them in that order. George has given us a buffet of great fantasy films, we just choose which ones we like best.



Fuck yeah!

Well said man!

http://www.facebook.com/DirtyWookie

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Originally posted by: HotRod
Fuck me Gaffer man. I've just read your post from page one, and man you can fucking talk!

Took me fucking ages to read that shit, man.
I'll read the rest of this thread in a minute, but I just wanted to say now, that Fuck me man, you really don't like TPM.

Man!


How come nobody notices that I was just quoting Seiji?! That wasn't me who wrote that! And even Seiji says that that was just a compilation of ideas from other fans that he just agrees with!

There is no lingerie in space…

C3PX said: Gaffer is like that hot girl in high school that you think you have a chance with even though she is way out of your league because she is sweet and not a stuck up bitch who pretends you don’t exist… then one day you spot her making out with some skinny twerp, only on second glance you realize it is the goth girl who always sits in the back of class; at that moment it dawns on you why she is never seen hanging off the arm of any of the jocks… and you realize, damn, she really is unobtainable after all. Not that that is going to stop you from dreaming… Only in this case, Gaffer is actually a guy.