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Episode IV title Crawl question

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Hey, simple question, pretty sure ive seen the answer before but cant find it right now.

when was Episode IV A New Hope added to the title crawl of Star Wars?

-Darth Simon
Why Anakin really turned to the dark side:
"Anakin, You're father I am" - Yoda
"No. No. That's not true! That's impossible!" - Anakin

0100111001101001011011100110101001100001

*touchy people disclaimer*
some or all of the above comments are partially exaggerated to convey a point, none of the comments are meant as personal attacks on anyone mentioned or reference in the above post
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I believe it was added for the 1981 re-release.....but others are more knowledgable than I....
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Yep, the 81 re-release AFTER Empire was released, not before.
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hmm, thanks, I think that is what i remember reading

In addition to when it was first shown with the new crawl, does anyone know when Lucas actually added the crawl to the film? was it while he was working on ESB? (when did production of ESB start? does anyone know?)

Actually, any information you can provide as far as the release dates of star wars, when changes were made, and early info on ESB (such as the production) that is/could relate to release/change dates of Star Wars (ANH) would be most helpful.

Thanks

-Darth Simon

*edit, chainsawash posted while i was typing...but from what your saying the title crawl change was most likely made during production of ESB then?
Why Anakin really turned to the dark side:
"Anakin, You're father I am" - Yoda
"No. No. That's not true! That's impossible!" - Anakin

0100111001101001011011100110101001100001

*touchy people disclaimer*
some or all of the above comments are partially exaggerated to convey a point, none of the comments are meant as personal attacks on anyone mentioned or reference in the above post
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also, what would a CED videodisc be? is that just a laserdisc format?
Why Anakin really turned to the dark side:
"Anakin, You're father I am" - Yoda
"No. No. That's not true! That's impossible!" - Anakin

0100111001101001011011100110101001100001

*touchy people disclaimer*
some or all of the above comments are partially exaggerated to convey a point, none of the comments are meant as personal attacks on anyone mentioned or reference in the above post
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It's an early laserdisc format.

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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thanks

I just found this site http://www.benandgrover.com/timeline.asp

is the information here correct?
if so, the 78 and 79 re-releases of starwars would have contained the same title crawl that was shown in 77 correct? and would actually (soundmix issues asside) be the same version as shown in 77?

-Darth Simon
Why Anakin really turned to the dark side:
"Anakin, You're father I am" - Yoda
"No. No. That's not true! That's impossible!" - Anakin

0100111001101001011011100110101001100001

*touchy people disclaimer*
some or all of the above comments are partially exaggerated to convey a point, none of the comments are meant as personal attacks on anyone mentioned or reference in the above post
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CED was RCA's videodisc format. No lasers involved, except those of the rival format that beat it . See here.
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Where were you in '77?

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Originally posted by: SilverWook
See here.

Great link, really enjoyed reading it. Thanks!
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"CED was RCA's videodisc format. No lasers involved"

Oops, you're right. I forgot about the stylus.

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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Originally posted by: Darth Simon
In addition to when it was first shown with the new crawl, does anyone know when Lucas actually added the crawl to the film? was it while he was working on ESB? (when did production of ESB start? does anyone know?)

Actually, any information you can provide as far as the release dates of star wars, when changes were made, and early info on ESB (such as the production) that is/could relate to release/change dates of Star Wars (ANH) would be most helpful.

To be more specific than what has already been said, the updated crawl first appeared on the two week re-release that began on April 10, 1981.

Before that, however, the updated crawl first appeared in print within the book "The Art of Star Wars" that was published in November of 1979. This book contained the script complete with the "Episode IV" crawl.

However, when Lucas actually came up with "Episode IV: A New Hope" is open to debate and speculation. I do now believe, however, that he did have it in mind early enough to use it for the May 25, 1977 release if he had so chosen.

In the commentary on the official DVD, Lucas states that the studio would not allow him to release the film with the subtitle. This obviously implies that Lucas already had it in mind. But being from the official DVD, one might think that this statement is nothing more than revisionist propaganda; however, it does have precedent. In a 1980 issue of Bantha Tracks that was released just prior to The Empire Strikes Back, Lucas said this:

"Star Wars was the fourth story in the saga and was to have been called, "Star Wars, Episode Four: A New Hope." But I decided people wouldn't understand the numbering system so we dropped it. For Empire, though we're putting back the number and will call it Episode Five: The Empire Strikes Back."

So, in 1980 Lucas said it was HIS decision not to include the subtitle, but in 2004 he said the studio would not let him. But in both cases he claims that it was already in place.

An important note in all of this is that Gary Kurtz backs up Lucas' statements. I somehow find Gary Kurtz to be more reliable. This is from a 1980 issue of Globe:

"George dropped the episode number and sub-title because he thought it might be confusing," said Kurtz. "Also, after showing each of the nine treatments to the people at 20th Century-Fox in 1975, they thought that episode four revealed more information about the characters and would make a better introduction to the story."

What's different is that Kurtz says the execs at 20th Century-Fox were actually in favor of the subtitle from the very beginning, whereas Lucas now says the were not.
Greedo shoots first? Not in my DVD player.
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And speaking of CED, you guys may get a kick out of this.
Greedo shoots first? Not in my DVD player.
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That ad is a nice trip down memory lane. One of RCA's mistakes was not seeing the need for stereo sound (let alone video and audio jacks) until a couple years into the format. (They once did a promotion where if you bought a stereo player and an RCA big screen set, you got Star Wars for free!) They even managed to make a player with LD-esque interactive features but the format was already doomed by then. Return of the Jedi was among the last batch of titles ever made for CED. So rare, some early SW collectible price guides didn't even know it existed.
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Where were you in '77?

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OK so I bet that for the 1980 audiences, who first watched ESB on movie theaters, as they seen the Star Wars logo again onscreen, must have thought "wtf...?". And when they read "EPISODE V", must have thought "WTF!!!??"
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Obi-Wan Spicoli, that was great! Thank you very much.

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: Sadly, I believe the prequels are beyond repair.
<span class=“Bold”>JediRandy: They’re certainly beyond any repair you’re capable of making.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>MeBeJedi: You aren’t one of us.
<span class=“Bold”>Go-Mer-Tonic: I can’t say I find that very disappointing.</span></span>

<span class=“Italics”>JediRandy: I won’t suck as much as a fan edit.</span>

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Originally posted by: Darth Simon
thanks

I just found this site http://www.benandgrover.com/timeline.asp


WOW! I've read this timeline in a movies magazine more than 10 years ago, and as I remember it, it's the exact same words as in this timeline! The exact same one...
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Obi-Wan Spicoli,

Thank you much for this information, as some of you may have gathered the reason for my request of this information was for the following thread that I started http://www.originaltrilogy.com/forum/messageview.cfm?catid=2&threadid=2552

Unfortunatly, this changes some of my assumptions made, so based on the information present in the copyright listing for Star Wars and the dates the LoC aquired their copies if the crawl was already made and could have been present in the 1977 version than its possible that the versions that the LoC recieved in '78 & '79 include this crawl...the two things that makes this seem unlikely however is that the copyright date is may 25 1977, and when the subtitles for the hearing impaired were added this was noted in the copyright so it would make sense that the addition of information to the crawl would also have been noted. Also, the fact that the rereleases of Star Wars were all without the Episode IV until 1981 and the copies the LOC recieved were before this date.

What is also strange is that the earliest copy that the LOC has is dated as being aquired about a year after the movie came out. Now there is the fact that the online copyright database only contains works registered on or after 1/1/1978, but i dont think that would keep an aquisition of the film reels in 1977 from appearing on the information I refer to in the other thread.

I was giving a few more sources I can check, so hopefully I can unquestionably establish what version the print the LOC has on file is.

-Darth Simon
Why Anakin really turned to the dark side:
"Anakin, You're father I am" - Yoda
"No. No. That's not true! That's impossible!" - Anakin

0100111001101001011011100110101001100001

*touchy people disclaimer*
some or all of the above comments are partially exaggerated to convey a point, none of the comments are meant as personal attacks on anyone mentioned or reference in the above post
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Time
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Originally posted by: Darth Simon
Unfortunatly, this changes some of my assumptions made, so based on the information present in the copyright listing for Star Wars and the dates the LoC aquired their copies if the crawl was already made and could have been present in the 1977 version than its possible that the versions that the LoC recieved in '78 & '79 include this crawl...the two things that makes this seem unlikely however is that the copyright date is may 25 1977, and when the subtitles for the hearing impaired were added this was noted in the copyright so it would make sense that the addition of information to the crawl would also have been noted. Also, the fact that the rereleases of Star Wars were all without the Episode IV until 1981 and the copies the LOC recieved were before this date.

I don't believe that any print of the film contained the updated crawl until 1981. The '78 and '79 theatrical presentations were the same as in '77, and there was no 1980 release. I DO believe that Lucas had "Episode IV" in mind as early as 1975, but it was NOT implemented into the film until late 1980 and was not presented theatrically until the following 1981 re-release. Therefore, if the LoC acquired 35mm prints in '78 and '79, those prints must contain the original crawl.

There was a page at the official site (which seems to have disappeared) in which Lucasfilm film archivist Sterling Hedgpeth stated:

"I found a box with all the positive elements for the 'revised' opening crawl, and the assorted trim boxes are dated from October through December 1980. This, then, is consistent with the view that Episode IV: A New Hope was added for the first time to the opening crawl for the April 10, 1981 re-release."

This is significant because he specifically mentions the raw film elements for the revised crawl as being dated Oct-Dec 1980. Therefore, the revising of the crawl could not have taken place before these dates.
Greedo shoots first? Not in my DVD player.