The Last Jedi: Official Review and Opinions Thread ** SPOILERS ** — Page 15

SilverWook said:

Mark just knocked it out of the park with this. I sincerely hope he gets an Oscar nomination.

Absolutely.

SilverWook said:

And since I only really know Laura Dern from Jurassic Park, I thought raptors would show up and chase her. 😉

You gotta see Blue Velvet. And Rambling Rose. And she’s awesome as Diane in S3 of Twin Peaks.

Speaking of Twin Peaks, 2017 was the year where David Lynch owned the remake/remodel/resurrect a brand thing. Nobody does it better.

Here’s a pretty good article about the film: https://www.avclub.com/part-kurosawa-part-wile-e-coyote-the-last-jedi-boldl-1821291545

RE: Ackbar vs. Holdo, the author of this piece has a good point in a response to a comment:

Ignatiy Vishnevetsky said:

Lotta folks seem to think that her role should have gone to good ol’ Admiral Ackbar, but I get Johnson’s intention: Everybody likes Ackbar, and the audience needs to be fooled into Poe’s point-of-view.

Hal 9000 said:

I think I got an analogy for how part of me feels about THE LAST JEDI.

I feel like the grandfather from The Princess Bride was in the middle of telling Fred Savage a story. He had to leave and he came back the next day. Except, it wasn’t him that came back, but Rick (of Rick and Morty).

I was with you until you said “Rick” and I’m like “I don’t know who that is.”

SilverWook said:

Shopping Maul said:

Matt.F said:

Holdo staying behind to be the ‘captain going down with the ship’ wasn’t well earned, as it was only really her ship for a couple of hours.

Someone on this site might correct me, but isn’t the Cruiser the same one that Ackbar commands in Return Of The Jedi? Having Ackbar stay behind to do the hyperspace ram would have been an epic end to a fan fave, far better than the derisory off screen death he recieved.

As for Ackbar not telling Poe the plan, that would be an easy fix - “loose lips sink battleships” and for a character who famously found himself in a trap before he’d be keeping tight lipped for sure!

I think the sacrificial lamb should have been Threepio. Firstly, it’s absurd that they didn’t use a droid for the final run. Secondly, I think Threepio has been woefully neglected as a character over the years. It would’ve been amazing to have Threepio go out in a blaze of glory. Imagine him saying something like “bravery is not part of my programming, but I will do what I must!” (or something)…

If there’s one thing Lucas never changed his mind on, it’s that the droids are supposed to be in all the episodes. I’d rather they keep it that way to the end of this trilogy at least.

Sure, but this series has already gone way beyond any vision Lucas may have held to.

The thing is Star Wars films always have those moments where the viewer is taken out of the ‘logic’ of the movie for whatever subjective reasons. For some it might be Starkiller Base, or Leia’s space-walk, or even ‘sound in space’. For me it was seeing Threepio boarding an escape shuttle while a respected leader was supposed to blow herself up for the greater good. It pushed the ‘droids are people too’ notion of the series over the line (IMO).

Which got me thinking about Threepio’s character overall. He was a pretty sassy dude in the first couple of movies - despite his overall demeanour. He sweet-talked Owen into purchasing him and R2, pulled that great stunt with the Stormtroopers in the control room (“they’re madmen! They’re heading for the prison level…”), and had a wonderful sense of camaraderie when it counted (“Stormtroopers? Here? I must tell the others!” or “Chewie, they’re behind you!”). Over the years he’s been relegated to just being a cameo figure like Nien Numb. Plus, Tony Daniels seems to be voicing a caricature rather than Threepio himself. When I first saw TFA, my wife turned to me and said “is someone else doing his voice now?”. He just doesn’t sound like he used to.

Anyway, I’m making too big a deal of this, but I really thought this could’ve been a great moment for ol’ Goldenrod. Maybe next time!

I think what ultimately led me to not love the sequel trilogy so far is how unrealistic Rey’s character is. I agree that Luke didn’t get much training, but what the hell is this? The girl was pulling off mind tricks out of nowhere, she has mastered several force abilities that took years for Luke to master, and she has only had 3 lessons from Luke and that’s it. Rey wasn’t even bested by anyone yet (and I don’t think she will), and we’re two movies in. She was fooled by Snoke/Kylo, yes, but this film didn’t feel like her low point, and it probably was. I can see that she was challenged, but she didn’t lose. The rest of the good guys did, but she didn’t. Ughh
If someone disagrees and is able to give me logical reasons for all of this, please do.
Specifically for The Last Jedi, I didn’t like what they did to Luke’s character, as Mark said, “I fundamentally disagree with everything you did to my character” or something like that. But the execution was so brilliant, and Mark was so amazing, that I give it a pass. But I don’t believe that Luke, the most hopeful guy in the galaxy, would even consider killing someone simply because there’s darkness inside them. And I’m not sure if I’d buy crazy Luke if not for Mark. But because I did, oh boy Luke was AMAZING.

Shopping Maul said:

SilverWook said:

Shopping Maul said:

Matt.F said:

Holdo staying behind to be the ‘captain going down with the ship’ wasn’t well earned, as it was only really her ship for a couple of hours.

Someone on this site might correct me, but isn’t the Cruiser the same one that Ackbar commands in Return Of The Jedi? Having Ackbar stay behind to do the hyperspace ram would have been an epic end to a fan fave, far better than the derisory off screen death he recieved.

As for Ackbar not telling Poe the plan, that would be an easy fix - “loose lips sink battleships” and for a character who famously found himself in a trap before he’d be keeping tight lipped for sure!

I think the sacrificial lamb should have been Threepio. Firstly, it’s absurd that they didn’t use a droid for the final run. Secondly, I think Threepio has been woefully neglected as a character over the years. It would’ve been amazing to have Threepio go out in a blaze of glory. Imagine him saying something like “bravery is not part of my programming, but I will do what I must!” (or something)…

If there’s one thing Lucas never changed his mind on, it’s that the droids are supposed to be in all the episodes. I’d rather they keep it that way to the end of this trilogy at least.

Sure, but this series has already gone way beyond any vision Lucas may have held to.

The thing is Star Wars films always have those moments where the viewer is taken out of the ‘logic’ of the movie for whatever subjective reasons. For some it might be Starkiller Base, or Leia’s space-walk, or even ‘sound in space’. For me it was seeing Threepio boarding an escape shuttle while a respected leader was supposed to blow herself up for the greater good. It pushed the ‘droids are people too’ notion of the series over the line (IMO).

Which got me thinking about Threepio’s character overall. He was a pretty sassy dude in the first couple of movies - despite his overall demeanour. He sweet-talked Owen into purchasing him and R2, pulled that great stunt with the Stormtroopers in the control room (“they’re madmen! They’re heading for the prison level…”), and had a wonderful sense of camaraderie when it counted (“Stormtroopers? Here? I must tell the others!” or “Chewie, they’re behind you!”). Over the years he’s been relegated to just being a cameo figure like Nien Numb. Plus, Tony Daniels seems to be voicing a caricature rather than Threepio himself. When I first saw TFA, my wife turned to me and said “is someone else doing his voice now?”. He just doesn’t sound like he used to.

Anyway, I’m making too big a deal of this, but I really thought this could’ve been a great moment for ol’ Goldenrod. Maybe next time!

FWIW his “red arm” line in TFA is one of my favs…although maybe it’s just because in my personal canon Ric Olie didn’t die, he just moved his spirit to 3PO.

Collipso said:

I think what ultimately led me to not love the sequel trilogy so far is how unrealistic Rey’s character is. I agree that Luke didn’t get much training, but what the hell is this? The girl was pulling off mind tricks out of nowhere, she has mastered several force abilities that took years for Luke to master, and she has only had 3 lessons from Luke and that’s it. Rey wasn’t even bested by anyone yet (and I don’t think she will), and we’re two movies in. She was fooled by Snoke/Kylo, yes, but this film didn’t feel like her low point, and it probably was. I can see that she was challenged, but she didn’t lose. The rest of the good guys did, but she didn’t. Ughh
If someone disagrees and is able to give me logical reasons for all of this, please do.

To turn Han’s line on it’s head, maybe because that’s the way the force works?

Maybe the force is different in this girl than in the the boy we saw in the OT.

Or maybe Ren was lying and her parents weren’t nobodies. Although I kind of hope he was telling the truth. I don’t mind all the various family ties in the OT but it would still be refreshing for Rey to not be related to anyone in the story.

Her intention wasn’t to blow herself up. She stayed behind to pilot the ship. yes, she knew there was zero chance of making it, but sacrificing themselves to save everyone else is a tactical decision. She was and Admiral and , Now leia is back, she relinquished her leadership and went back to doing what she does best. But do you really think 3P0 would have tuned the ship around and self sacrificed himself when push came to shove like she did? He was a coward. plus he wan’t a tactical droid so it’s doubtful he would have even come up with a solution like that in the first place. Nothing to do with “droids are people too”

You’re probably right. It just seems odd to me that, in a universe where anthropomorphic droids can basically emulate the work (and thought processes) of humans, there’s no way someone would self-sacrifice when a droid could do the job. As for Threepio’s cowardice, I’m assuming Threepio’s overall sense of loyalty would cancel out that aspect of his personality programming. Don’t forget he managed to warn Luke about Jabba’s trap-door, even while sporting a restraining bolt. The reason I pointed out Threepio’s actions in those first two films was to show that, when push came to shove, he was capable of being tactical as well as loyal.

Then again Obi Wan did say (in AOTC) that “if droids could think there’d be none of us here” so maybe I’m on the wrong track.

Just got around to seeing it today. I’ll save an in depth review/analysis for after I’ve seen it another time or two, but count me in the group of those pretty disappointed in it. Which honestly makes me sad because I expected to enjoy it greatly and loved TFA.

This I believe was the longest SW film to date, and it really shouldn’t have been. There’s a lot I would’ve cut. (Most of the third act I would have cut altogether or saved for IX).

TV’s Frink said:

Collipso said:

I think what ultimately led me to not love the sequel trilogy so far is how unrealistic Rey’s character is. I agree that Luke didn’t get much training, but what the hell is this? The girl was pulling off mind tricks out of nowhere, she has mastered several force abilities that took years for Luke to master, and she has only had 3 lessons from Luke and that’s it. Rey wasn’t even bested by anyone yet (and I don’t think she will), and we’re two movies in. She was fooled by Snoke/Kylo, yes, but this film didn’t feel like her low point, and it probably was. I can see that she was challenged, but she didn’t lose. The rest of the good guys did, but she didn’t. Ughh
If someone disagrees and is able to give me logical reasons for all of this, please do.

To turn Han’s line on it’s head, maybe because that’s the way the force works?

Maybe the force is different in this girl than in the the boy we saw in the OT.

Or maybe Ren was lying and her parents weren’t nobodies. Although I kind of hope he was telling the truth. I don’t mind all the various family ties in the OT but it would still be refreshing for Rey to not be related to anyone in the story.

I agree, it was really satisfactory to me when Ren said that her parents were nobodies. And yeah, maybe the force is just different with her, but I don’t know, not sure if I’m convinced. But the “she’s a Skywalker” “she’s a Palpatine” explanations don’t convince me either, and now they’re not even a possibility. Apparently she couldn’t have been mind wiped either

In short, like some others others I have conflicted feelings about the movie (saw it on Wednesday, I really liked it, but I do need a second viewing, whenever there’ll be a non-dubbed screening). One thing bugged me a bit at the very beginning though: Unless I heard wrong, they reused the TFA recording for the main title, which I found a bit lazy (and remeniscent of AotC and RotS)…

That aside, it still was a great joy to be sitting and thinking “Damn, I’m actually discovering a new Star Wars movie!” 😄

The intro crawl theme didn’t sound like a new recording.

Darth Lucas said:

Just got around to seeing it today. I’ll save an in depth review/analysis for after I’ve seen it another time or two, but count me in the group of those pretty disappointed in it. Which honestly makes me sad because I expected to enjoy it greatly and loved TFA.

This I believe was the longest SW film to date, and it really shouldn’t have been. There’s a lot I would’ve cut. (Most of the third act I would have cut altogether or saved for IX).

Just got back from seeing it too.

I have a lot of moments I loved in it (Luke tossing the lightsaber, almost everything on the casino planet, the subversion of the redemption/temptation arcs, the way that they compromise between people wanting to see Luke be Bad-ass and those who didn’t want him to be made into a prequel joke) but man did I feel the Jedi arc and Resistance arc didn’t flow nicely. It had segue scenes, yes, but they felt like two different movies put into one all the same. Also, while I didn’t really get pulled into the Jedi arc at first, it had pay-off, unlike the resistance half, wherein it felt like nothing had any real pay-off.

Ending fatigue was another big one. I swear, there were at least two other points before the actual ending that the film could’ve ended on. Personally, I’d have probably ended the film when the jump to lightspeed to cut everyone in half trick was used.

I walked out of the theater on Thursday night feeling genuinely conflicted. How very different that was from how I felt upon my initial viewings of TFA and Rogue One, which I loved almost immediately (despite their flaws, which they certainly do have).

I’ve avoided coming online for two whole days because I wanted to process what I’d seen on my own before I started getting the opinions of others. But even now, having read through this thread as well as reviews and discussions on several other sites, I’m still not sure how I feel. What a mixed bag TLJ is! There were parts that I loved, absolutely… But there were also things that I HATED (not merely disliked, mind you, but truly hated), and I suppose I wasn’t prepared for that. I need to see it again before I can make up my mind.

flametitan said:

almost everything on the casino planet

Really? I feel like you’re the first to say that, most people seem to agree it was the weakest part of the film.

If nothing else, the “riding the CGI animals” stuff was prequel-level awful.

TV’s Frink said:

flametitan said:

almost everything on the casino planet

Really? I feel like you’re the first to say that, most people seem to agree it was the weakest part of the film.

If nothing else, the “riding the CGI animals” stuff was prequel-level awful.

Well I feel like a terrible person then, as I loved how enthusiastic Rose was during that. shrug I guess I was just hooked into the arc of the Resistance’s survival more than I was the Rey/Kylo arc was (until the end of the movie, where it just felt like there was no real payoff for the Resistance’s actions.)

flametitan said:

TV’s Frink said:

flametitan said:

almost everything on the casino planet

Really? I feel like you’re the first to say that, most people seem to agree it was the weakest part of the film.

If nothing else, the “riding the CGI animals” stuff was prequel-level awful.

Well I feel like a terrible person then

Cool.