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The Last Jedi: Official Review and Opinions Thread ** SPOILERS ** — Page 13

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The Last Jedi (2017)

I had tickets safely booked in several weeks before release. I’d be watching The Last Jedi at the local Curzon with my family, including two young daughters who’d both very much enjoyed The Force Awakens. However, as a keen Star Wars poster collector with a completist streak, when I heard news that Odeon were giving out an exclusive poster on opening weekend to those who saw the film in 3D I hastily scrabbled together a second viewing, this time with friends. So I’m writing this review having watched The Last Jedi twice on consecutive nights! I’ve only ever done that once with a movie before (Back To The Future, and that was indeed way back as a 13 year old in 1985).

Despite The Last Jedi being longer than any Star Wars movie to date, the older me thoroughly enjoyed every minute. The length, and the episodic structure of the movie, gave it the feeling of watching a box set TV show. Those evenings when you watch two episodes and really ought to go to bed, but then you look at your partner and go… shall we do just one more?

The opening crawl has never had less to do, as the action follows on so closely from The Force Awakens. Rey is holding out the lightsabre plaintively to Luke (his response drew howls of laughter from the audience on both nights – this movie has belly laughs throughout and is comfortably the funniest of all the Star Wars films), and up in space above the evacuated Rebel Base (we get just a tiny glimpse of Greenham Common) the Rebels are doing a runner after exposing themselves by their assault on Starkiller Base.

Here we see more of the lighter tone as Poe first trolls General Hux to buy time for the rebels and then runs rings around an old warhorse type First Order General who is piloting an enormous Dreadnought Class Star Destroyer. I’d have liked to have seen more of this General as he seems competent and professional in the military manner that we’ve come to expect from the Empire – Hux really does not, and is generally played as the butt of the joke in every scene he’s in, which does reflect back on the First Order and makes them seem a bit toothless and unthreatening.

The bomber run on the Dreadnought is a bravura opening set piece, the James Bond tactic of giving the audience some major action right from the off. Really well delivered sequence, which achieves the tricky balance of evoking the mayhem of battle whilst retaining clear geography and audience understanding of what’s going on. On first viewing I did wonder why the camera lingered so much on the Asian bomber pilot with her unusual necklace, but that small query was answered soon after as she is shown to be the sister of Rose – a new character who would act as a foil for Finn and provide the film with a moral centre. She is a character that might be viewed as ‘sappy’ by some, but to balance her – and balance is certainly a strong theme throughout – she shares many scenes with another new character, DJ played by Benicio Del Toro, who represents the absence of morality altogether.

However Finn, Rose, and DJ’s story is a side dish to the main event (in fact it could be excised altogether with little impact on the rest of the tale, however for me that would be a great shame as there is much to enjoy in the Canto Bight sojourn and I’d much rather have more Star Wars rather than less). The meat of the story is Rey’s journey, and the pull she endures between Kylo and Luke. Daisy Ridley remains a magnetic presence to watch, and is an actress that effortlessly takes the audience on a journey with her, just as Mark Hamill did in Star Wars. The two of them have some wonderful interactions, and the rocky crags of Jedi Island (I know it has a proper name but it’s always going to be Jedi Island to me) provide a great backdrop to their spiky and unpredictable relationship. The monastic environment also allows for the mystical mythos of Star Wars to percolate and brew in a way that it hasn’t done since Dagobah. Nature is the Force and the Force is everywhere. It elegantly retcons the mistake of Midichlorians, and the Force is no longer a medical condition that can be measured by a blood test… a product of your genes. Once again those childhood dreams of anyone being able to become a Jedi through dedication, meditation and hard work are back on the table.

Throughout her stay on Jedi Island, Rey also builds a relationship with Kylo. Like a creepy internet romance they speak remotely through the force. When Rey eventually goes to him, and the two of them stand before Snoke, as an audience you really don’t know how this encounter is going to play out – beautifully handled by Rian Johnson. And then… the sequence that the film has been building towards. Played out in Snoke’s blood red chamber – never forget that cinema is a visual medium – the fight sequence between Rey, Kylo and the Royal Guards is one for the ages. A real stunning treat for the eyes, and the highlight of the film for me.

Whilst on highlights it would be remiss if I didn’t mention lowlights. For me, BB8 in the Scout Walker didn’t work, either conceptually or in execution. And story wise I would have preferred for Admiral Ackbar to occupy the role that was given to new character Admiral Holdo.

I would put The Last Jedi on par with both The Force Awakens and Rogue One, and all three of these new films would sit slightly below the Original Trilogy. It’s my favourite film of 2017, and I am thrilled to have new Star Wars content to enjoy and rewatch. As Kylo says, ‘let the past die’, and we are now all set for the new cast of Star Wars to do battle in the final act of the trilogy.

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chyron8472 said:

I am feeling like these arguments from the people vehemently defending hating TLJ, they’re rationalizing. They want to hate it, and so are finding reasons to justify their position.

Yes, it seems some people have thrown reason out the window, and are being willfully obtuse about it.

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This movie deliberately challenges what I want out of Star Wars. If that’s it’s goal, it is incredibly successful. I don’t like what it did with “my stories,” and that was what the movie was trying to do. It successfully makes me feel conflicted about it, which is good and bad. Which is good.

My stance on revising fan edits.

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DrDre said:

As such, this trilogy is like that game where you fold a piece of paper and each person takes it in turns to draw a head/torso/legs then unfold the paper and see what weird monster drawing you end up with.

That’s such an accurate description in my view. RJ mostly disregarded every setup of TFA. Take the simple example of Han telling Rey and Finn, that Luke went to look for the first Jedi Temple. Given that setup, and Luke’s emotional response at the end of TFA, you would expect he had gone there in hopes of finding some ancient wisdom to deal with the threat of Snoke and Kylo. The TFA script states:

“Older now, white hair, bearded. He looks at Rey. A kindness in his eyes, but there’s something tortured, too. He doesn’t need to ask her who she is, or what she is doing here. His look says it all.”

So, why did Luke go there? To die. If he wanted to die, and see the Jedi end, why go a place associated with the Jedi in the first place. Seems to me the FO would have found him eventually. Why not go to some random unknown Island? Why not kill yourself, if you’re so convinced it should all end? Why did he wear these elaborate white Jedi robes at the end of TFA? He sure seemed an almost mythical Jedi Master with the wisdom of the ages, waiting for the right person to arrive. That moment and the character of Luke have been completely deflated. It’s twists and shocks for the sake of it, all the while sacrificing the integrity of a classic character to prop up some new ones. Next we’ll learn Han and Leia beat Kylo as a kid. Shocking isn’t it. Bet you didn’t see that one coming.

To be fair Han’s mention of the Jedi Temple was mere speculation from ‘those who knew him best’. I think the point being made in TLJ is that no-one really knew him after all - least of all us!

I actually like RJ’s take on Luke’s exile. I’ve always had issues with the way ROTJ ended in terms of the ethics presented, so I never saw Luke as a master of anything beyond making sure his Nazi father got a quick bedside conversion before the Death Star went boom. TLJ seems to have shaken that almost childish ROTJ notion of ‘good and bad’ and restored the more nuanced version of the Force implied in TESB.

I’m a little confused about the whole ‘map to Skywalker’ thing in TFA though. Why the hell was there a map then? If Luke really didn’t want to be found, why not just erase that chunk of the map entirely (if not the whole map) rather than have it end up on Max Von Sydow’s flash drive?

Also, Luke seemed to be doing something cryptic with R2 in TFA (presumably making R2 power down for a specific timeframe?) but now it seems he was just leaning on the little guy for support.

I’m still very much on the fence with this new series by the way, but it’s all very interesting if nothing else.

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Yoda Is Your Father said:

TavorX said:

Yoda Is Your Father said:

Does anybody have anything good to say about the finale in which the star destroyer gets totalled by Laura Dern light-speeding through it and Finn/Rose/Phasma being the only survivors then BB8 piloting an AT-ST?

Come at me with positivity about that whole scene, I could do with a laugh.

I was absolutely left stunned with that sacrifice scene; I could feel the whole theater in such awe of that visual! That’s the first time a movie visually surprised me in that way. Usually, eye candy to me makes my eye roll because it’s just there for a cool factor with little purpose. Here, there was more emotion behind it, so I really loved that moment.

Oh and BB-8 with the Walker caught me by surprise too; I really thought it was going to be the codebreaker.

Fair enough.

Agree it was visually quite cool.

Personally I had no emotional attachment to Laura Dern’s character. In fact I thought she kind of sucked, so her sacrifice meant very little to me.

And even if it had, Finn, Rose, Phasma and BB8 surviving the total destruction of a Star destroyer just felt very convenient to the point that it took me out of the movie and destroyed any cool factor that had come before.

BB8 piloting an AT-ST is up there with R2’s rocket jets (and for the record I loved BB8 in TFA, so aim not just a BB8 hater like some folk. I would have liked to see him have a bigger role in the movie as a whole a la R2 in the OT).

Artoo is capable of taking over control of an X-Wing for Luke so he can take a nap, so why can’t BB-8 operate a scout walker?

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SilverWook said:
why can’t BB-8 operate a scout walker?

I was a very weird Rick and Morty reference ! (“I’m scout walker BB-8888888888888888” 😃). The kind of Deus Ex Machina I didn’t like. Very silly (like most of the subplots).

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 (Edited)

Pop culture reference or not, the question still stands.

Half the things in Star Wars depend on Deus Ex Machina. Your point? 😉

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Where were you in '77?

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Good lord was this ever better the second time around. 100% on board. Fight me, jerks.

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joefavs said:

Good lord was this ever better the second time around. 100% on board. Fight me, jerks.

I’m hoping that’ll be my experience too. I’m still conflicted.

The Luke/Rey/Kylo story was fantastic. Poe and Laura Dern grappling for command, less so (though I did enjoy Princess Leia). The Finn and Rose story I found uninteresting. It felt like something from a completely different movie.

And I can’t tell you how much I loved the scene with Yoda!

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Man, that was some recycled bullshit, peppered with WTF moments…

Excuse me while I milk my sea cow’s teats; gone fishin’!! Leia unconsciously force wills herself through space and even though there is absolutely no airlock when Poe opens the door, no one gets sucked out. Creatures, creatures everywhere!! Yeah…what’s that you say, another pod race? Sure, but let’s use some of those cute Pandora-like animals. Another Cantina scene? Sweet, but this time let’s make it a casino that exists in the movie and plot for absolutely no reason, except for, I don’t know, pod races? Why the effing eff doesn’t Laura Dern turn that effing ship around the moment she saw that first effing transport ship get oblieterated?? How about we just wait until there is only three or four left, cause reasons. Hoth? Nah, that’s not snow, it’s salt, but trench warfare and walkers, we can reuse those and nobody will notice. And while we’re at it, let’s throw some ROTJ in this thing for good measure “Oh, you are here by my design, I have foreseen everything and now you must watch my fleet finally kill your rebel friends right before I convince you to turn to the dark side, but I am not going to notice this effing light saber right fricking next to me because I have mad concentration skills; oops, I’m dead thanks to my apprentice. Dammit.” Battering ram? Hell yeah, that’s some old Death Star tech we had laying around…What the actual f@#$?

I wanted to like this, I really did. There were some great moments and, at times, some truly stunning visuals, but I left the theatre with a sour taste in my mouth from being spoon fed regurgitated ideas and concepts from the previous films. I understood that some of this was needed in TFA, but personally I felt that this was to be the film to finally get the story going somewhere fresh or new, but I guess not. Disney is way too smart…recycle, repackage and make bank. “Just think of all of those awesome new toys we can sell.”

For those who loved the film, more power to you and I am truly glad that you enjoyed it and, truthfully, a bit sad that I could not. On the plus side, hopefully this will make a great edit some day.

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dahmage said:

Did anyone catch Joseph Gordon-Levitt in this? I didn’t, will look again tonight.

No, but I did spot Gareth Edwards’ cameo in the trenches on that salty planet.

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 (Edited)

Saw it the second time today. I too have conflicted feelings about it. There’s definitely twists I did not see. Killing off Snoke and Phasma after only two movies I thought was a big twist. Definitely some love triangles forming here (you know which ones they are). Some of this I like better than TFA some I don’t but mostly the former. New themes and old ones. Definitely a lot of ROTJ vibes with most of Snokes scenes. I did feel there was more to keep hidden with this movie than TFA. However even my feelings for TFA are still somewhat conflicted. I did think Luke’s use of the Force at the end was brilliant and had never seen the Force used to such an extent in any other SW film. Yoda was a nice surprise and I’d rather him than spirit Anakin personally. Will probably see this a third time sometime this week hopefully. Definitely a good watch but where it ranks among my favorites I’ve yet to decide.

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crissrudd4554 said:

Killing off Snoke and Phasma after only two movies I thought was a big twist.

I wouldn’t be at all surprised that Phasma is still alive. There was foreshadowing of a laser blast which simply deflected off her armour just before she fell through the flames, so I think the film makers could in good faith have her return. Snoke less so!

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MalàStrana said:

SilverWook said:
why can’t BB-8 operate a scout walker?

I was a very weird Rick and Morty reference ! (“I’m scout walker BB-8888888888888888” 😃). The kind of Deus Ex Machina I didn’t like. Very silly (like most of the subplots).

I have not seen that episode. I do not watch Rick & Morty. And I don’t feel I’m missing anything by not having that connection, whether it was intended or not.

TV’s Frink said:

chyron just put a big Ric pic in your sig and be done with it.

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I saw it yesterday. Today I started reading this thread and I haven’t even made it past the first page but this comment is spot on.

DominicCobb said:

Yeah, okay… holy fucking shit!

JEDIT: haha of course you guys hated it, what else should I have expected from this joyless site

And I’m sure it continue to be spot on for the rest of the thread.

Anyway, I liked it. Far from perfect, some dumb stuff and some stuff that bugged me (I’m actually considering a serious edit of this one), but solid overall. Rey, Luke, Kylo, Poe, and Leia were fantastic. Special shout-out to Carrie who was given more to do this time and seemed more comfortable in her new role than in TFA.

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Page 10 thought.

DominicCobb said:

I don’t know what it is, maybe I’m tired of all the time I spent defending TFA, but I honestly don’t even think I can bother with trying to respond to a lot of these negative reviews. Maybe it’s the volume, maybe I’m just shocked that there’s even such an outcry to begin with. Our takes on the film are just so different that I honestly don’t know how to bridge that gap, besides just hoping these people see the movie again and get out of it what I, and many others, did. It’s really something.

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TV’s Frink said:

I saw it yesterday. Today I started reading this thread and I haven’t even made it past the first page but this comment is spot on.

DominicCobb said:

Yeah, okay… holy fucking shit!

JEDIT: haha of course you guys hated it, what else should I have expected from this joyless site

And I’m sure it continue to be spot on for the rest of the thread.

Anyway, I liked it. Far from perfect, some dumb stuff and some stuff that bugged me (I’m actually considering a serious edit of this one), but solid overall. Rey, Luke, Kylo, Poe, and Leia were fantastic. Special shout-out to Carrie who was given more to do this time and seemed more comfortable in her new role than in TFA.

That shot of her looking out the front door of the old base with her face half covered by her collar stands out in my mind. It’s haunting. Amazed I got through the movie without crying actually.

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The only time I teared up a bit was when she got her Princess shout-out in the end credits. But I was so happy to see her fully on-board as Leia again. In TFA she didn’t get much to work with and seemed kind of stiff with what she had. Her she seemed natural, like her old self again.

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And we got her and Mark in the same scene which meant a lot to me.

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Matt.F said:

I would have preferred for Admiral Ackbar to occupy the role that was given to new character Admiral Holdo.

Yes! Great idea. That would have made that whole plot line 100% better.

War does not make one great.

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SilverWook said:

And we got her and Mark in the same scene which meant a lot to me.

Speaking of which, I loved the quick little introduction between Poe and Rey. I forgot it took them almost two full movies to meet!

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DominicCobb said:

chyron8472 said:

I am feeling like these arguments from the people vehemently defending hating TLJ, they’re rationalizing. They want to hate it, and so are finding reasons to justify their position.

Yes, it seems some people have thrown reason out the window, and are being willfully obtuse about it.

This is unfair. I wanted to like it (I loved TFA) and I am openly jealous of those people who loved it, wishing I could be in their number. But I’m not.

The same argument could be levelled at some of the people who loved it despite its many glaring flaws. They ‘wanted to like it’ and so will say anything to convince others (and themselves).

Or maybe the above is bullshit and people just like different things… how about that?

War does not make one great.