Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo — Page 419

look, you want shit on me for thinking national anthem should be respected and not protested? fine do so. fuck it. I am done with this conversation.

moviefreakedmind said:

I don’t remember that. I liked Sinead’s protest of the pope and Catholic Church, though.

I am sure RicOlie_2 would have something to say about that.

I am done with this conversation.

Respect is something that is earned. For a lot of people, our country has not earned their respect. Not everyone is as fortunate as you or I. But they’re football players! you say. They are fortunate, sure, but they’re not kneeling for themselves, they’re kneeling for others.

I am done with this conversation.

Warbler said:

ChainsawAsh said:

I’d really like to hear why you think it’s wrong to protest the National Anthem. So far all I see is you saying “It’s wrong because it’s wrong,” with no reasoning as to why it’s wrong.

I answered this last year in the original politics thread. Here is what I said:

I’ll tell you why it upsets me. When the National Anthem is played, it is not a time to make a political statement,

Why not?

it is a time to show respect for the country.

Who says?

The Anthem and flag aren’t about what is going with current politics. They aren’t about Obama or the Democrats or the Republicans or the current policy of the day. They symbolize America.

And that’s what they’re protesting. They’re upset with the state of America.

Freedom,

Such freedom of speech?

justice,

Like the justice, or rather, injustice; that they’re protesting?

rights,

Perhaps the right to protest?

equality.

Which they view as very important, as evidenced by their protesting.

They symbolize the ideal, not necessary what the current politicians are doing. And yes, they symbolize all the sacrificing and fighting and dying done to make this country and to preserve it. To me, when you protest the National Anthem, you are not protesting the bad cops and racists and whatnot, you are protesting the idea of America.

They are only protesting what they choose to protest. If they’re sitting down during the national anthem to protest inequalities of some sort, then that’s all they’re protesting.

You are protesting what makes this nation great.

What really makes this nation great is it’s freedom.

You protesting those that sacrificed to make this nation great.

I thought those soldiers died for our freedom.

Finally to me, it is just an unwritten rule that years ago, no one would have thought of breaking: You don’t protest things like the flag or the Nation Anthem. You just don’t do it. It classless.

I wouldn’t use the people of the past as a moral measurement, they were pretty horrible.

Instead of repeatedly saying you are done with the conversation, you could, you know, just post about something else.

moviefreakedmind said:

TV’s Frink said:

Instead of repeatedly saying you are done with the conversation, you could, you know, just post about something else.

He started a conversation with me about RicOlie_2’s relationship with Sinead O’Connor and then refused to participate in it.

Sorry about that. I guess I never should have started that conversation.

Warbler said:

moviefreakedmind said:

I don’t remember that. I liked Sinead’s protest of the pope and Catholic Church, though.

I am sure RicOlie_2 would have something to say about that.

You might have to wait a year for his thoughts on the matter.

DominicCobb said:

Respect is something that is earned. For a lot of people, our country has not earned their respect. Not everyone is as fortunate as you or I. But they’re football players! you say. They are fortunate, sure, but they’re not kneeling for themselves, they’re kneeling for others.

I do get where you’re coming from, Warb, but I disagree. Quoting Dom because he articulated how I feel about it pretty much to a T.

Tyrphanax said:

I’ve always felt that, the moment you make something “sacred” and “unquestionable” you immediately corrupt it.

It’s definitely an impossible ask at least, especially when it’s an element of a democratic establishment (as opposed to say a religious object). If America stands for freedom, its people have the freedom to decide what the flag means to them, and in this case the flag represents a failure in that mission for freedom. In this way, people getting mad at those kneeling during the anthem are kinda helping prove their point.

Jeebus said:

Warbler said:

ChainsawAsh said:

I’d really like to hear why you think it’s wrong to protest the National Anthem. So far all I see is you saying “It’s wrong because it’s wrong,” with no reasoning as to why it’s wrong.

I answered this last year in the original politics thread. Here is what I said:

I’ll tell you why it upsets me. When the National Anthem is played, it is not a time to make a political statement,

Why not?

it is a time to show respect for the country.

Who says?

The Anthem and flag aren’t about what is going with current politics. They aren’t about Obama or the Democrats or the Republicans or the current policy of the day. They symbolize America.

And that’s what they’re protesting. They’re upset with the state of America.

Freedom,

Such freedom of speech?

justice,

Like the justice, or rather, injustice; that they’re protesting?

rights,

Perhaps the right to protest?

equality.

Which they view as very important, as evidenced by their protesting.

They symbolize the ideal, not necessary what the current politicians are doing. And yes, they symbolize all the sacrificing and fighting and dying done to make this country and to preserve it. To me, when you protest the National Anthem, you are not protesting the bad cops and racists and whatnot, you are protesting the idea of America.

They are only protesting what they choose to protest. If they’re sitting down during the national anthem to protest inequalities of some sort, then that’s all they’re protesting.

You are protesting what makes this nation great.

What really makes this nation great is it’s freedom.

You protesting those that sacrificed to make this nation great.

I thought those soldiers died for our freedom.

Finally to me, it is just an unwritten rule that years ago, no one would have thought of breaking: You don’t protest things like the flag or the Nation Anthem. You just don’t do it. It classless.

I wouldn’t use the people of the past as a moral measurement, they were pretty horrible.

Ok, I said I was done with this, but this misunderstanding of my position needs a response. I am a totally for freedom. I totally and without reservation agree that it is the right of any football player/person to protest the national anthem. It is legal and I agree with it being legal 110%. I wouldn’t want it any other way. I don’t know how I can make that clearer.

moviefreakedmind said:

Warbler said:

moviefreakedmind said:

TV’s Frink said:

Instead of repeatedly saying you are done with the conversation, you could, you know, just post about something else.

He started a conversation with me about RicOlie_2’s relationship with Sinead O’Connor and then refused to participate in it.

Sorry about that. I guess I never should have started that conversation.

It’s a fine conversation, I just don’t get why you’d start it and then refuse to respond.

Sorry it was just bad timing.

I do hope I have made it clear that as much as I disagree with their decision to protest the nation anthem, I agree it is their right to do so. The Constitution protects their right to protest the national anthem, and I wouldn’t want it any other way.