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Episode 3: Fan Editing Ideas Discussion

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 (Edited)

I knew all that hype about Episode 3 being Lucas’ redemption, and considered by fans to be “the best of them all” was utter bullshit, and I was right. However, it is the best of the prequels and I think has alot of potential in the capable hands of people like MagnoliaFan, who know how to construct a better film using all available resources. This thread should serve as a compilation of all the ideas and criticisms I have read in various posts on the board. Also, if anyone with editing experience could give insight on how, in your estimation, some of this stuff could be accomplished, post as well. This is my list, of what needs to be fixed.

#1. Flat deliveries, Anakin’s angst, Yoda’s inexplicable grammar, Palpatine’s over the topness, Vader’s dialog and pansy scream, clone trooper screams, midichlorians, etc. all this stuff has to be addressed in some way. Be it through deletion, creative editing, or adding alternative dialogue.

#2. General Grievious needs to be a threatening villian, the jedi killing machine seen in clone wars, not a coward who runs from a fight. So the first thing cut should be Mace calling him cowardly. He doesn’t have a mouth, so in theory you could make him say anything you wanted at any time. Give him a cooler metallic sounding voice speaking english, or an alien language. This applies to the annoying battle droids and nemodians as well. Get rid of the coughing, cut out all the running away from a lizard, and if there are any deleted scenes with his backstory, put that in.

#3. The opening space battle doesn’t strike the appropiate tone. It feels like a screwball comedy, not a tense rescue mission. The pacing and transitions are particularly bad here as well.

#4. Anakin’s turn to the darkside has to somehow be made more drawn out and believable. When he does turn, I think Padme should more concretely reject the evil bastard, and then have Anakin force choke her a bit longer.

Republicans suck.
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It's not that I disaprove the idea, but this thought was on my mind as I left the movie theater thursday at 2:30 am: it is IMPOSSIBLE to make a MagnoliaFan edit over this, and GL did it on porpouse. You can cut bits and pieces, and maybe restore some cut scenes when those are available, but that's it. Maaaaybe overdub the Vader "nooooooo!" with something from the OTs, although I'm not sure what. There is NO way to make this film better editing what's available now.
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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If the dagobah scene is included on the dvd, I think that should go back in.

Another cutscene is grievous killing and fighting jedi, that should be put back in if its available, since that would make him more menacing.

Also maybe the anakin/obiwan fight and the yoda/emperor fight shouldnt be intercut, some have said it ruins the tension of the anakin fight

maybe the noooooooooooo bit could be replaced with a vader scream

theres just some random off the top of my head ideas
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Originally posted by: Darth Balls
If the dagobah scene is included on the dvd, I think that should go back in.

Another cutscene is grievous killing and fighting jedi, that should be put back in if its available, since that would make him more menacing.

Also maybe the anakin/obiwan fight and the yoda/emperor fight shouldnt be intercut, some have said it ruins the tension of the anakin fight

maybe the noooooooooooo bit could be replaced with a vader scream

theres just some random off the top of my head ideas


Dagobah and Yoda meditating and talking to Qui-Gon should be back, if those scenes exist in a final form and are available, which I doubt.
Weren't those 2 figths intercut? Memory's failing me now, maybe it's time to see it again...
Replace it with which scream? Vader having his hand cut?
Maybe add some tie-fighters around the death star? After all, this scene is obviously set a few years before the empire is formed (notice that they already have full uniforms). On a second thought, don't add anything, this would be too much close to an SE change...
“Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.” — Nazi Reich Marshal Hermann Goering
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Nay - cut the Death Star construction altogether. Unless your logic is that the Empire began DSII construction shortly after that, it makes no sense. Plus Tarkin is just odd there.
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I said shouldNT be intercut, they should not be intercut

I think the only time he screams is when his hand gets cut off?
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I loved the MagnoliaFan edits of Episode 1 and 2, but this film really doesn't need to be edited. The most I would suggest is putting in some deleted scenes, so I can see them in the actual movie instead of watching the movie and then going into special features. But really, there was nothing super annoying like in the previous two, even if there were some problems with it. If there is an edit made of this film, I doubt I'll get it...
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it is IMPOSSIBLE to make a MagnoliaFan edit over this, and GL did it on porpouse.


Yeah, George made ROTS as a giant middle finger to MagnoliaFan I'm sure as he and Barton put the finishing touches on the last reel, he nudged him and said "Let's see MagFan try to mutilate THIS one, huh?" and then they hit the commisary for some Mallomars.
The Best Show You've Never Heard
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Originally posted by: The Bizzle
it is IMPOSSIBLE to make a MagnoliaFan edit over this, and GL did it on porpouse.


Yeah, George made ROTS as a giant middle finger to MagnoliaFan I'm sure as he and Barton put the finishing touches on the last reel, he nudged him and said "Let's see MagFan try to mutilate THIS one, huh?" and then they hit the commisary for some Mallomars.


Actually, it really wouldn't surprise me if deep down, GL actually did put some small details in there to make it harder for MagnoliaFan to make an edit. I also wouldn't be surprised if GL read these boards regularly, or at least had someone who printed different topics off of this site for him to read...
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I think there are some instances that could be improved through fan editing. Although it depends on the music and whatnot, which GL probable made hard fan edit around. Anyway, obvious things

-The droid stuff at the beginning with R2 could be changed (at least the voices)

-Get rid of the damn explaining everything. (an example is Anakin telling us about the spherical droids on Obi-Wan's fighter) We don't need any more Ric Ollies.

-Obviously find away to modify Grievous, even if it means deleting most of his scenes.

-get rid of midichlorians. So what if we don't know where Anakin comes from? The alternative isn't any better.

Then there's things I would do:

Make Anakin's character less confused. I know that Anakin was supposed to be skating the fence on who to trust, but it was somewhat poorly done. I think there is enough material to make him more one-sided (both before and after he learns Palp's true colors) by deleting certain stuff. At least make it 75/25 instead of 50/50. To me, it never seemed that Anakin fully turned to the darkside, there were certain scenes that were contradictory and/or ambiguous. One example is his regret of helping to take out Mace. Cut this. Basically just streamline the Palpatine manipulation machine on Anakin and focus primarily on the promise of saving Padme, and less on politics. That way there's more of an impact of him turning to the darkside

-Cut some of the fast-cuts during the battle scenes. The were overdone. Slow things down a little.

-Delete the "she's physically fine, she just lost the will to live" line

I would even go as far as to severly trim down the Yoda v. Palps scene (while also putting it before the Anakin v. Obi-Wan duel). At least make Yoda seem like he is winning. I say this because I don't understand why Palps sees the need for Vader after the end of the movie, if there's no threat (virtually no Jedi and no rebellion yet). If he sees Yoda as more powerful, perhaps he knows he needs Vader's help.

Again, these might not be possible, but it just seems with some selective cuts things could be more concise.
40,000 million notches away
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The biggest thing for me would be the removal of the droid voices. Seeing these lumbering Super Battle driods have squeaky voices just damages any menace they had.

Maybe find a way to insert the idea that Grievous is Maul. If it can be done in a believable way. If not, find some other way to increse his threat.

If anything can be done to slow Anakins turn, any scenes after, "What have I done" where Palpatine convinces he's doing the right thing would help. The Removal of the line might help otherwise.

I agree on possibly moving up the Yoda duel. It did break the moment the first time I saw it, and It's still a bit sudden on the second time.


Made for IE Forum's Episode III theme month - May 2005.

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All I have to say is- it is very much possible to make this film better, and after the DVD comes out, I'm going to try it. I think just replacing Grievous' voice would already be a huge improvement.

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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My suggestions, because I REALLY would like to see a good fan-edit of this one:

-Neimodian voices were severly botched - no consistency with the other two prequels.

-Palpatine's "Yeah!" at the beginning when Obi-Wan takes out the Super Battle Droids. Not in character for him.

-The "Padme dying of a broken heart" thing needs to go. Make her die because of Anakin's Force choke.

-Instead of rehashing old Han Solo lines, (see: "This is where the fun begins") why didn't Anakin do some of Vader's one-liners like "All too easy" or "There will be no one to stop us this time" or even something as simple as "As you wish." There was none of this.

-And what's with the Obi-Wan "flying's for droids" line? He seems to hate flying, yet he's always flying. I don't get why Lucas keeps emphasizing this.

-I thought Alec Guiness said he hadn't gone by the name of Obi-Wan since before Luke was born. Leia also mentions he served Bail Organa in the Clone Wars. Oh yeah? When?

-Reinsert Mon Mothma/birth of Alliance scenes and the Dagobah landing. Qui-Gon should definitely be in there. And if additional scenes exist, some more of Kashyyk would be nice.

-Speaking of Wookiees, cut out the stupid Tarzan yell.

-I didn't like Palp's line about "My apprentice will be more powerful than either of us, Yoda." Because, truthfully, he won't.

-Samuel L. Jackson gives the most stale line readings of all time in this one - rivaling even the Phantom Menace for worst acting. His performance needs major work.

-And some work definitely needs to be done on the Vader scene. Waaay too Frankenstein, to the point of laughter. Cut out the stumbling forward, and maybe the "Noooo!" could be replaced with the Vader yell from the ESB duel when Luke hits Vader's shoulder. That sounded pretty angry. Also, Palps needs to blame OBI-WAN for Padme's death, or the Jedi, not Anakin! I have no idea what the hell Lucass was thinking!

-The music in this movie was completely hacked up by the editors, it could use some smoothing out. And where was "Luke and Leia's Theme" from ROTJ during the birth scene? I think it would've made more sense to use that than Luke and Leia's seperate themes. Use their seperate themes when they are split up. And where was the Emperor's theme (hello?) and I would've really liked to hear that male choral bit from the Father vs. Son duel in ROTJ at some point in the film, during Mace's death even.

-One last thing. I really missed Anakin's murder of Shaak Ti in the Jedi Temple. That certainly needs to be reinserted.

That's all I can think of for now. PLEASE someone start working on this! And then let me know where to get it.

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You know...If Lucas is reading this, he sees exactly what we want...and then, those scenes suddenly DON'T appear on the DVD extras.

That would be a strange coincidence, wouldn't it.

Oh, and I agree with what everyone says. Plus, make the lizard less talky. I swear, it seemed like that thing was making noise every 10 seconds.

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PLEASE someone start working on this! And then let me know where to get it.


Not until November!

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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Wow, really? That's an honor.

Although, it could've been a trap.
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I have an idea to remotely hint that Grievous is actually Maul.

Redub Grevious. Redub Maul's couple lines in TPM.

Using the same actor. Nothing more is said.

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

Emperor Jar-Jar
“Back when we made Star Wars, we just couldn’t make Palpatine as evil as we intended. Now, thanks to the miracles of technology, it is finally possible. Finally, I’ve created the movies that I originally imagined.” -George Lucas on the 2007 Extra Extra Special HD-DVD Edition

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Whoa, that's really cool MagnoliaFan! What was it like? Who was there?
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George and Rick, a lot of industry people I wouldn't know in a police line up, and I thought I saw Burtt and Coleman floating around at one point as well.

And for the record (even though he has stated it himself in an interview or two as has an LFL spokesperson), George isn't losing any sleep over re-edits. On the other hand, he certainly doesn't like the idea of other people profiting off of his work.
But when it comes to editing, he did the same thing when he was young, recutting old dogfight films and footage from films like the Great Train Robbery as quasi animatics for ideas. If there were conventions and the internet back then, his stuff would probably eventually have gotten leaked and bootlegged, too.

http://twitter.com/TheMagnoliaFan

http://www.youtube.com/user/magnoliafan78

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Holy crap, MagnoliaFan himself posting in my thread. Glad to hear that editing the film won't be a problem. I know you have your own artistic vision, but I think many of the suggestions given here deserve some consideration. We all want the best version possible.
Republicans suck.
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And I thought *I* was the only wookie-pimp here...
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When I watched the movie a third time, I noticed that it won't be possible to stream the Obi-wan and Anakin fight together. You'll have to have something in there breaking it up into segments. Because when they're fighting, and it cuts away to Yoda, when it comes back, they're in different places and poses. It would just jump around and look really weird if you tried putting it all together, because one second they'd be on a table and the next they'd be standing up on the ground... You see what I mean?

Once they get outside however, it'd be possible to stream the parts together. Just not when they're inside.

-edit-
Meh... the screen captures didn't work for some reason. If I can fix it, I'll post an example.