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Originally posted by: JediSage
Gorbachev? What did he do besides surrender? He was the leader of a totalitarian system that needed to be destroyed. Reagan (and Maggie and JPII) left him no options. And the only reason Reagan's administration did what they did with Iran-Contra is because the Democratically controlled congress refused to fund anti-communists in the Western hemisphere, in other words: Gave tacit aid to the Soviet flunkies in Central and South America. Or maybe the popular leftist views that Truman won the Cold War by losing China and Eastern Europe to the communists is right. Or that they really did have 75 years of bad weather and that's why communism didn't work.
Nixon: All he did was get us out of Vietnam (which JFK got us into, BTW) by bombing Cambodia then going directly to the Chinese. And, refresh my memory...who had the world on the bring of nuclear holocaust, JFK or Nixon? *cough* Missles of October *cough*
Mandella? Don't get me started.
OK before this goes on, let me remind everyone here, including yourself, that this is a political view discussion, and based on opinions. Opinions are like clocks, they can be a little bit foward or back, but no clock is entirely correct. Also, to discuss is not the same as to offend, and we are NOT letting this get personal. OK? I'm not competing with you, I'm not against you, we are just discussing points of view. No one is "right", there is no right answer. OK?
Reagan did have some part on it ("mr gorbatchov, tear down this wall"), but he was also not very sensitive on the subject, joking about the missles who were coming from ussr at that moment... Try to imagine how Regan and Maggie would act if Kruchev was on office... But I'll give you Reagan for an influencial man in the 20th, ok. He was influencial after all.
Iran-Contras: ok so let me get this straight, it is OK for a country to sell weapons to both Iraq AND Iran, so one can kill each other, and then get the profit from this and invest on killing civilians on suth american countries who had strong communist parties? Let me remind you, I'm from Brazil, who had a violent dictatorship for 20 years backed up by the CIA, the US secret service, and with actions authorized by Lyndonn Jonshon and Nixon. I've talked about it enough on another topic, but if you want me to go on I will.
Nixon: he got you out of Vietnan? OK correct me if I'm wrong - I'm not being sarcastic, I don't know, correct me! - but didn't the US withdraw from Vietnan in 1975, when Ford was on office? Now, imagine if the US had never invaded Vietnan, the north would win the same way as it did, right? And how is Vietnan today? Eh? There's a freaking McDonalds on Ho Shi Ming City (Saigon).
JFK: The missle crisis would have a very different ending if Kennedy was not on office. A mushroom cluded ending. But I don't know, maybe what've read on the subject and on the actions taken by the White House back then were wrong...
Mandella: What's wrong with him? OK you don't like him, let's have MLKJr and Steve Biko only...