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I don’t see any point in arguing this with you any further.
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Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo — Page 111
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The whole immigration debate is over-simplified. It’s so easy to lay it all on the undocumented worker - he/she broke the law. But the U.S. is totally complicit. There are enormous financial incentives for them to come, and for big agribusiness to hire them, and to maintain this as the status quo. Heck, it’s our nation’s breadbasket – and what politician is willing to incur the political fallout of rising food prices and angry big growers, by fixing a broken immigration system and stemming the steady stream of cheap labor that provides so much low-cost skilled farm labor?
People don’t realize how skilled these migrant workers are, and how much they get done for such low pay. They don’t just pick. They do the pruning, and care for the orchards. And just try picking grapes - you’ll be lucky to last one day (I know this first hand).
I hate seeing these struggling people used as political fodder. The politicians huff and puff, and act all big deporting some mother from the midwest, all to cheering followers who’ve been convinced they are the cause of all of our nation’s ills. All while doing nothing of substance. Why else do every one of our presidents end up granting amnesty to thousands of undocumented workers? It’s a sick game and the most unfortunate are the pawns, IMHO.
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The whole immigration debate is over-simplified. It’s so easy to lay it all on the undocumented worker - he/she broke the law. But the U.S. is totally complicit. There are enormous financial incentives for them to come, and for big agribusiness to hire them, and to maintain this as the status quo. Heck, it’s our nation’s breadbasket – and what politician is willing to incur the political fallout of rising food prices and angry big growers, by fixing a broken immigration system and stemming the steady stream of cheap labor that provides so much low-cost skilled farm labor?
People don’t realize how skilled these migrant workers are, and how much they get done for such low pay. They don’t just pick. They do the pruning, and care for the orchards. And just try picking grapes - you’ll be lucky to last one day (I know this first hand).
I hate seeing these struggling people used as political fodder. The politicians huff and puff, and act all big deporting some mother from the midwest, all to cheering followers who’ve been convinced they are the cause of all of our nation’s ills. All while doing nothing of substance. Why else do every one of our presidents end up granting amnesty to thousands of undocumented workers? It’s a sick game and the most unfortunate are the pawns, IMHO.
Agreed.
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The whole immigration debate is over-simplified. It’s so easy to lay it all on the undocumented worker - he/she broke the law. But the U.S. is totally complicit. There are enormous financial incentives for them to come, and for big agribusiness to hire them, and to maintain this as the status quo. Heck, it’s our nation’s breadbasket – and what politician is willing to incur the political fallout of rising food prices and angry big growers, by fixing a broken immigration system and stemming the steady stream of cheap labor that provides so much low-cost skilled farm labor?
People don’t realize how skilled these migrant workers are, and how much they get done for such low pay. They don’t just pick. They do the pruning, and care for the orchards. And just try picking grapes - you’ll be lucky to last one day (I know this first hand).
I hate seeing these struggling people used as political fodder. The politicians huff and puff, and act all big deporting some mother from the midwest, all to cheering followers who’ve been convinced they are the cause of all of our nation’s ills. All while doing nothing of substance. Why else do every one of our presidents end up granting amnesty to thousands of undocumented workers? It’s a sick game and the most unfortunate are the pawns, IMHO.
Well said. It’s another of these issues wherein we like to see band-aids but no actual holistic reform taking place that will actually impact the issue. Building a wall won’t help. Deportations won’t help. It’s the same with many things in this country.
Keep Circulating the Tapes.
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Immigration laws are there for a reason, yes, and I agree with the reason. But breaking them is not so heinous a crime as murder or rape, or even assault or theft. Saying it’s their fault for being stigmatized is just blaming the victim. These people have lived a tough life. Do you think it was easy for them to leave their country and come here? Just because they broke the law doesn’t mean we should treat them like criminals. I would say that yes you are falling into a trap of rigidity of thought and making blanket judgements. I break the law nearly every day by jaywalking but that doesn’t mean I shouldn’t be allowed to cross the street. And so why deportation can be such an overly harsh punishment. When I say these people are citizens of the land they call home, I mean just because they don’t have papers doesn’t mean they don’t live here. That woman who was deported has lived in America longer than I have. But she wasn’t as fortunate as I.
Great post. Made me think.
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The whole immigration debate is over-simplified. It’s so easy to lay it all on the undocumented worker - he/she broke the law. But the U.S. is totally complicit. There are enormous financial incentives for them to come, and for big agribusiness to hire them, and to maintain this as the status quo. Heck, it’s our nation’s breadbasket – and what politician is willing to incur the political fallout of rising food prices and angry big growers, by fixing a broken immigration system and stemming the steady stream of cheap labor that provides so much low-cost skilled farm labor?
Trump is. Not just because he doesn’t care about fallout, but also because he doesn’t understand the consequences of his actions. He was elected to lead not read.
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He was elected to lead not read.
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I don’t see any point in arguing this with you any further.
I’m sorry. I did not mean to upset you or offend you.
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I don’t see any point in arguing this with you any further.
I’m sorry. I did not mean to upset you or offend you.
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I don’t see any point in arguing this with you any further.
I’m sorry. I did not mean to upset you or offend you.
Trust me you really didn’t. Just sometimes you reach a point where an argument can only go in circles.
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I don’t see any point in arguing this with you any further.
I’m sorry. I did not mean to upset you or offend you.
I am happy to see that you at least apologize to some people. It shows that you’re not as cold as you sometimes make yourself out to be.
😃
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The whole immigration debate is over-simplified. It’s so easy to lay it all on the undocumented worker - he/she broke the law.
I wasn’t laying it all on the illegal immigrant. I am just saying they played a part in this mess. They crossed the border knowing it was against the law. They had children here knowing that any day they could be separated from them and some of them had children in a deliberate attempt to prevent deportation.
But the U.S. is totally complicit. There are enormous financial incentives for them to come, and for big agribusiness to hire them, and to maintain this as the status quo.
maybe somewhat, but it is not like they forced people to cross the border at gun point.
Heck, it’s our nation’s breadbasket – and what politician is willing to incur the political fallout of rising food prices and angry big growers, by fixing a broken immigration system and stemming the steady stream of cheap labor that provides so much low-cost skilled farm labor?
I wish someone would have the guts to fix the immigration system. If we think think the laws are bad or unfair to those wishing to come here, change them.
People don’t realize how skilled these migrant workers are, and how much they get done for such low pay.
To me, how skilled they are is irrelevant. I don’t care whether they pick grapes or are computer engineers. What about the fact that they take jobs away from people that are here legally?
They don’t just pick. They do the pruning, and care for the orchards. And just try picking grapes - you’ll be lucky to last one day (I know this first hand).
a lot of that depends how fit you are and how healthy you are. Knowing my condition I am sure I wouldn’t last an hour.
I hate seeing these struggling people used as political fodder. The politicians huff and puff, and act all big deporting some mother from the midwest, all to cheering followers who’ve been convinced they are the cause of all of our nation’s ills. All while doing nothing of substance.
That is not what I want. I don’t want people to be used as political fodder and I don’t cheer any deportation that would separate families. As for our nations ills, they do play a part. They are not the sole cause or maybe even one of the bigger causes, but they do play a part. They do not pay taxes, yet cost us in various government services, they take jobs away from people who are here legally.
Why else do every one of our presidents end up granting amnesty to thousands of undocumented workers? It’s a sick game and the most unfortunate are the pawns, IMHO.
Yes, it is sad and unfortunate.
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deleted.
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http://gizmodo.com/members-of-trumps-club-can-just-pose-with-the-president-1792299605
Do you have $200,000 and a fascination with the prospect of nuclear annihilation? You may want to look into purchasing a membership at Mar-a-Lago, the “winter White House,” where this weekend some guy posted a selfie with the Trump aide who carries the United States’ nuclear football.
Given that the nuclear football follows Trump everywhere and is therefore photographed a lot, the photo itself isn’t really a security issue. But these pictures are another sad reminder that anyone with $200,000 to spare, including the random guy who played Restaurant Patron in the comedic film Ted, can buy a level of access to the president and his closest staff. He can even hobnob with the guy who holds in his hands the power to vaporize the planet. Just another cool thing to keep in mind about this insane world we now occupy.
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Warbler said:
They do not pay taxes, yet…
That simply isn’t true. They pay a huge amount of taxes:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/niallmccarthy/2016/10/06/how-much-tax-do-americas-undocumented-immigrants-actually-pay-infographic/#4abfc75f640e
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Well, I guess I stand corrected, but I don’t understand how someone here illegally, without a social security number, on some company’s payroll illegally, would be able to pay taxes.
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From the article…
Many who do not file tax returns still have taxes deducted from their pay checks. Out of that $11.64 billion total, undocumented immigrants pay $6.9 billion in sales and excise taxes, $3.6 billion in property taxes and about $1.1 billion in personal income taxes. ITEP estimated that if America’s 11 million undocumented immigrants were granted citizenship allowing them to work legally, current state and tax contributions would be boosted by over $2.1 billion a year.
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And people threw a fit over emails.
Sunday night, CNN reported details of the moment that Trump, joined by Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe, learned about a missile launch in North Korea. Trump and Abe were enjoying dinner at Trump’s exclusive Mar-a-Lago Club in Florida at the time, but, CNN reported, began to discuss the details of this international incident right there at their table.
“As Mar-a-Lago’s wealthy members looked on from their tables, and with a keyboard player crooning in the background,” CNN’s Kevin Liptak reported, “Trump and Abe’s evening meal quickly morphed into a strategy session, the decision-making on full view to fellow diners, who described it in detail to CNN.”
Earlier in the week, Trump had been criticized for leaving intelligence documents vulnerable to people without security clearance. Sen. Martin Heinrich (D-N.M.) noticed that the president kept the key in a secured bag while hosting people in the Oval Office, which is a bit like leaving your house keys in your front door while you’re having a party in your backyard. There’s no indication that anyone saw anything confidential in this incident, but this, Heinrich suggested, was “Classified 101.”
Notice, though, that the photos appear to corroborate an important detail from the CNN report. “The patio was lit only with candles and moonlight, so aides used the camera lights on their phones to help the stone-faced Trump and Abe read through the documents,” Liptak writes. In DeAgazio’s first photo, you can see a phone flashlight being used in that way.
Why is this important? Mobile phones have flashlights, yes — and cameras, microphones and Internet connectivity. When Edward Snowden was meeting with reporters in Hong Kong at the moment he was leaking the material he’d stolen from the NSA, he famously asked that they place their phones in the refrigerator — blocking any radio signals in the event that the visitors’ phones had been hacked. This was considered the most secure way of ensuring that the phones couldn’t be used as wiretaps, even more secure than removing the battery. Phones — especially phones with their flashes turned on for improved visibility — are portable television satellite trucks and, if compromised, can be used to get a great deal of information about what’s happening nearby, unless precautions are taken.
Precautions weren’t taken. One of DeAgazio’s photos shows Trump using a phone at the table, within view of other diners (and while sitting next to a foreign leader). It’s not clear what phone Trump is using in that picture, but it’s known that he uses a relatively old Android device, even while serving as president. As we noted last week, Trump generally uses that device when he’s not in the middle of a work day. Shortly before the dinner with Abe, he tweeted from it.
A working dinner tonight with Prime Minister Abe of Japan, and his representatives, at the Winter White House (Mar-a-Lago). Very good talks!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) February 11, 2017
The problem is that Trump’s Android phone would be very simple to hack to provide precisely the sort of access described above. NPR dug into the question of how secure that phone might be, and Berkeley computer scientist Nicholas Weaver was blunt.
“Donald Trump for the longest time has been using a insecure Android phone that by all reports is so easy to compromise, it would not meet the security requirements of a teenager,” Weaver told NPR, and while he couldn’t say for sure, “we must assume that his phone has actively been compromised for a while, and an actively compromised phone is literally a listening device.”
What a fucking idiot.
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http://theconcourse.deadspin.com/everything-about-this-breitbart-interview-with-sean-spi-1792204911
For a far-right blog with white nationalist ties, Breitbart has gained incredible access to the White House. Trump’s inner circle is populated with numerous alumni, and today, their fawning pro-Trump propaganda paid off as they were granted an exclusive Facebook Live with unhinged press secretary Sean Spicer.
It was insane.
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And people threw a fit over emails.
Sunday night, CNN reported details of the moment that Trump, joined by Japanese Prime Minister Shinzo Abe, learned about a missile launch in North Korea. Trump and Abe were enjoying dinner at Trump’s exclusive Mar-a-Lago Club in Florida at the time, but, CNN reported, began to discuss the details of this international incident right there at their table.
“As Mar-a-Lago’s wealthy members looked on from their tables, and with a keyboard player crooning in the background,” CNN’s Kevin Liptak reported, “Trump and Abe’s evening meal quickly morphed into a strategy session, the decision-making on full view to fellow diners, who described it in detail to CNN.”
Earlier in the week, Trump had been criticized for leaving intelligence documents vulnerable to people without security clearance. Sen. Martin Heinrich (D-N.M.) noticed that the president kept the key in a secured bag while hosting people in the Oval Office, which is a bit like leaving your house keys in your front door while you’re having a party in your backyard. There’s no indication that anyone saw anything confidential in this incident, but this, Heinrich suggested, was “Classified 101.”
Notice, though, that the photos appear to corroborate an important detail from the CNN report. “The patio was lit only with candles and moonlight, so aides used the camera lights on their phones to help the stone-faced Trump and Abe read through the documents,” Liptak writes. In DeAgazio’s first photo, you can see a phone flashlight being used in that way.
Why is this important? Mobile phones have flashlights, yes — and cameras, microphones and Internet connectivity. When Edward Snowden was meeting with reporters in Hong Kong at the moment he was leaking the material he’d stolen from the NSA, he famously asked that they place their phones in the refrigerator — blocking any radio signals in the event that the visitors’ phones had been hacked. This was considered the most secure way of ensuring that the phones couldn’t be used as wiretaps, even more secure than removing the battery. Phones — especially phones with their flashes turned on for improved visibility — are portable television satellite trucks and, if compromised, can be used to get a great deal of information about what’s happening nearby, unless precautions are taken.
Precautions weren’t taken. One of DeAgazio’s photos shows Trump using a phone at the table, within view of other diners (and while sitting next to a foreign leader). It’s not clear what phone Trump is using in that picture, but it’s known that he uses a relatively old Android device, even while serving as president. As we noted last week, Trump generally uses that device when he’s not in the middle of a work day. Shortly before the dinner with Abe, he tweeted from it.
A working dinner tonight with Prime Minister Abe of Japan, and his representatives, at the Winter White House (Mar-a-Lago). Very good talks!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) February 11, 2017
The problem is that Trump’s Android phone would be very simple to hack to provide precisely the sort of access described above. NPR dug into the question of how secure that phone might be, and Berkeley computer scientist Nicholas Weaver was blunt.
“Donald Trump for the longest time has been using a insecure Android phone that by all reports is so easy to compromise, it would not meet the security requirements of a teenager,” Weaver told NPR, and while he couldn’t say for sure, “we must assume that his phone has actively been compromised for a while, and an actively compromised phone is literally a listening device.”
What a fucking idiot.
Christ my brain.
Keep Circulating the Tapes.
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lol
Keep Circulating the Tapes.
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It would be funny if it weren’t true.