Beauty and the Beast - 35mm "Help Needed" (a WIP) — Page 3

RU.08 said:

Swift S. Lawliet said:

And AOTC was a different version on the 35mm version rather than the digital cinema version (which is also on DVD).

Well I can tell you because I saw both AOTC and ROTS on film on release that some scenes were quite grainy! For example, the battle in ATOC on Geonosis had some scenes which were quite grainy. Anyway, I doubt they would have outputted 1280x1024 to film - the standard going all the way back to the early 90’s was to output 2K to film - does not apply to 3D like Toy Story (rendered at 1536×922). If we ever get a chance to scan AOTC/ROTS I am very confident they will be higher quality than the original digital versions, but lower than the BDs.

Yes, you’re right.

Anyways, can we try not to derail this discussion?

Swift S. Lawliet said:

Yes, you’re right.

Anyways, can we try not to derail this discussion?

Yeah sure of course. BATB is my favorite Disney movie which is why I can’t bring myself to watch the BD. All I do is look through it at paused scenes and digress. 😦

RU.08 said:

Swift S. Lawliet said:

Yes, you’re right.

Anyways, can we try not to derail this discussion?

Yeah sure of course. BATB is my favorite Disney movie which is why I can’t bring myself to watch the BD. All I do is look through it at paused scenes and digress. 😦

Anyways, I have a bootlegged Chinese DVD of the Diamond Edition.

It is very high quality, as far as a DVD will take it and has higher a bitrate than the official DVD for both video and audio.

It’s one of those Chinese DVD-9 bootlegs which deliberately mislabel it as a Blu-ray to note that it is sourced from a Blu-ray or just for the hell of it (usually the former).

And no, it’s not an AVCHD. It’s a standard DVD and can play in regular DVD players.

The DVD I have has no bonus material other than the soundtrack which is very highly compressed in 192kbps Dolby Digital 2.0 and it only contains the Special Edition and the audio commentary.

But this DVD has a higher bitrate for the audio, it’s in 640kbps Dolby Digital 5.1 downmixed from the Blu-ray’s DTS-HD Master Audio 7.1 (again, unbelievable for a DVD since most DVDs have 448kbps and most people think 448kbps is the maximum for DVD). It also has a 1509kbps DTS 5.1 (extracted from the core of the 7.1 DTS-HD MA) in 24-bit/48khz.

But that’s only the English audio.

It also has Mandarin, Cantonese, Thai and Korean dubs in 384kbps Dolby Digital 5.1 and the French audio in 192kbps Dolby Digital 2.0.

It also has English SDH, French, Spanish, Traditional and Simplified Chinese, Thai and Korean subtitles alongside subtitles in aforementioned languages for the audio commentary and sing along subtitles based on the Mandarin dub.

Bonus: The Mandarin version has Jackie Chan as the singing voice of the Beast and even sings the theme song in the end credits of the Mandarin dub alongside a Taiwanese singer named Sarah Chen.

They are more or less unofficial equivalents of Sony’s Superbit DVDs, having no bonus features for the sake of bitrate.

However, these DVDs may have bonus features like the occasional audio commentary and/or soundtrack.

There are a few with many bonus features but they are usually barebones aside from the occasional audio commentary and/or soundtrack.

But what I found really weird is that this version only has the Special Edition, without the “Theatrical” Edition nor the Work-in-Progress Edition in sight.

I know some bootlegs have seamless branching for movies with multiple versions.

I saw it on bootlegs of The Lion King and The Lord of the Rings Trilogy.

These “Blu-ray” DVD-9 bootlegs are the highest quality bootlegs I can see.

Again, they aren’t AVCHD and are just regular DVDs.

But these Chinese DVD-9 bootlegs in America, usually they only have wuxia films and the Studio Ghibli films (the Chinese love Studio Ghibli so much) there. They are apparently more common in Hong Kong and Philippines.

I saw plenty of them in my visits in both countries but never had the time to buy them.

Unlike most bootlegs, they aren’t that crazy looking and are pretty good imitations of the official versions, except for the misleading Blu-ray logo.

Ha! The sooner this get scanned the better. I haven’t seen any bootlegs, but from every single release I’ve seen world-wide going back to the VHS it does not look right! This project will show you how it should look. I can’t really say anything about the sound since it’s been more than 15 years since I’ve watched this film on home video or TV.

RU.08 said:

Ha! The sooner this get scanned the better. I haven’t seen any bootlegs, but from every single release I’ve seen world-wide going back to the VHS it does not look right! This project will show you how it should look. I can’t really say anything about the sound since it’s been more than 15 years since I’ve watched this film on home video or TV.

Yes, this restoration will be the best. I can feel it.

But this bootleg is still interesting, even if it’s unnecessary to this project, since it had 640kbps Dolby Digital audio on a standard DVD.

Something many people though was impossible, most people thought than 448 was the maximum, guess they were wrong.

And it plays even on regular DVD players.

Apaprently, most Chinese bootleg DVD-9 discs with the Blu-ray logo have 640kbps Dolby Digital alongside a 1509kbps DTS mix in the original language if it’s sourced from a Blu-ray.

Swift S. Lawliet said:

But this bootleg is still interesting, even if it’s unnecessary to this project, since it had 640kbps Dolby Digital audio on a standard DVD.

Something many people though was impossible, most people thought than 448 was the maximum, guess they were wrong.

The DVD specification limits AC-3 tracks to 448kbps. You can go beyond that bitrate with DTS, PCM, or MPEG-2 audio. If your disc has a 640kbps AC-3 track all it means is that it isn’t within DVD specifications, it’s certainly possible (and quite easy) to create such a disc.

If you happen to be reading my thread, here is a small gift to you - some unrelated trailers I had scanned (including the X-Men teaser!) Hopefully I can get some more later on, enjoy.

https://vimeo.com/valeyard

I can almost afford to have this scanned now, but I’m about €400 short. If anyone can help me make up the €400 it would be very much appreciated!

Not specialised cleaning, no. But the scanner will clean it prior to scanning for free. Other scanners charge a few hundred dollars for cleaning alone for the same service.

To bring you guys up to speed, I’m having the print shipped to the scanner. We should then be able to get some good quality sample images. It costs about €130 just to ship the print there. I’m in desperate need of a bit more pledged money to get it scanned. Any help would be appreciated.

Donation received from dbear. Many thanks!

One of our newer members has PM’d me asking how BATB looks on film compared with the WIP version found on the Diamond Bluray (see pictures). It’s a great question, so I thought I’d post a reply to it on the forum.

It’s been two years since I personally have seen BATB projected on film, and I’m unlikely to see it again in that way any time soon. BATB is quite a dark film, especially when compared to Aladdin and Lion King which are have very bright and lively colours.

The WIP version if memory serves me correctly is too dark. And it has other issues, like Belle’s hair resolving to black instead of brown in the first photo. There is detail lost in the dark areas beyond what I expect would be lost on the print itself (ie the shadows look crushed). For all we know though, the WIP version might look different to final release. It was an earlier version, and they may have used cheaper film for the interpositive or something that affected the final look of the picture. Or maybe they were using it as an experiment with their digital film-out process ahead of doing the final film.

I should have some great previews of the print soon, once we get it to the scanner, and that should settle the question of how the movie looks. What I can say with confidence is that it that no home release to date looks right - some are better than others - but none present the actual look of the picture on film.

More generous donations have been received from Melatius and dahmage. Many thanks to both of you!

A couple of people have asked me for better preview pictures. They will be coming in a couple of weeks. As I mentioned above though, I’ve spent almost half the money raised so far just to ship the print.

A few relatively cheap Disney prints came up for sale that I had to pass on. To make it even more explicit, I can’t even afford to bid on this movie at the moment though I would dearly love to!

If you love this movie and you would like to help please get in contact with me.

Thanks to Colson for your generous donation!

RU.08 said:

Thanks to Colson for your generous donation!

Hey, no problem.

Thanks go to both RooBee & TServo2049 for their generous donations.

Now in other news, if you don’t follow the Face/Off thread, the guys behind that (PDB and thxita) are giving the “early-access version” of their scan to their donators. The early access version will be BD25 size, and as I understand it not cleaned up (or minimal repairs). Given the sample images provided though, it looks like it will be a relatively clean scan like Jurassic Park.

Because we’re having stuff scanned at the same time, and Face/Off is fully funded, they will generously extend the early-access release of Face/Off to anyone who donates to this project as well!

If you think that’s generous… both RooBee & TServo2049 donated to that project and then to mine! Of course most of my donors have donated to other people’s projects before (as have I), but to see these guys do it within just a few days of donating to the other project is very generous indeed.

Thanks go Wazzles for his generous donation. At this rate, we might be able to get the film scanned by the end of the month! Hopefully we’ll have some good preview images soon, once the film finds its way to the scanner and he has time to get some for us…