Ryan

Wexter said:

Lot of people seem to take issue with the seemingly new “everyone can learn the ways of the Force” angle. I don’t get that. I think it is perfectly in line with the original Star Wars. Luke wanted to become a Jedi, because his father was one. As far as the audiences knew back then, even Han could master the Jedi ways if he cared to. Luke’s uniqueness only became a thing when the prequels established his father as an actual space Jesus.

The problem is that the first part of this new story strongly hints, that Rey’s parentage actually matters and then suddenly this other guy takes over the story and just goes “yeah, we’re not doing any of that”.

This is why I think it would have been best having Lucas in charge of the new trilogy, but have others write and direct the movies like in V and VI. I believe this is what he was planning to do, but then passed it onto Disney as he wasn’t sure he’d be able to finish it.

I still think Lucas was the backbone of the Star Wars universe and helped bind it together. Now the Star Wars universe feels like it’s just flapping in wind and is rudderless. I always thought it was great when Lucas would do interviews, and he would give backstory and explain things. I think Lucas had the entire Star Wars universe inside his head. And thus could keep it all together and all in the same direction.

I think for now on under Disney, the Star Wars universe will feel like fan fiction and/or piece-mealed together and feel like it’s being pulled in all different directions.

TV’s Frink said:

Speaking of other message boards, I just read this on another one, and it’s spot on.

All this discussion and posting really shows the tough part about working on franchises like this - I doubt there was nearly this much discussion, theorizing and fanboying for the original trilogy. It was fresh and there was no internet, not to mention no years of backstories, extended universe and ages for people to decide what Star Wars was to them. I don’t think you could ever make a perfect movie now for it that will satisfy everyone or even most people - again that’s why I respect Rian for doing what he did in this film.

This is why I originally felt that the original main characters like Luke, Leia, and Han shouldn’t be in the new trilogy.

But then I thought about it and changed my mind as I was expecting to have a badass all powerful Luke Skywalker. I figured it’d be worth the risk to be able to see a Luke kicking ass. But then we didn’t even get that. Oh well.

I doubt two years ago people would have said they wanted a Luke Skywalker who was living like a hermit in isolation and doesn’t really do anything in the movie as far as Jedi battles go, etc.

DominicCobb said:

Ryan said:

DominicCobb said:

Ryan said:

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

Matt.F said:

Looks like there is a thread for that so let me pose the question in a different way - “what was your least favourite scene or sequence in the film?”

Anyone can answer, and could be interesting to hear specific answers as many criticisms are broad ones.

For me, as much as I like BB8 I would happily say goodbye to the monocle alien feeding him coins and then the pay off scene of firing them at the guard. Also BB8 again, driving the Scout Walker didn’t work for me.

I’ve only seen it once. But my least favorite scene is Luke throwing his lightsaber behind his back in that joking manor. That’s the worst.

He wasn’t joking.

Well, whatever you want to call it. The tossing it behind his back in a goofy manor. It’s not just about being goofy, but also him tossing the lightsaber like it means nothing to him.

I get what they were trying to do. They were trying to have hermit Luke act like a goofball similar to how Yoda acted in Empire.

You don’t understand that scene at all, sorry.

Ok. I plan on watching it again next couple of weeks. And will watch it again on Blu-Ray. Also looking forward to the Johnson commentary track. Really wish JJ had done one

He did, it was the main selling point of the second release.

Oh, I never knew that. I bought the first release as soon as it was on the stores shelves. I did hear there was a second release, but didn’t really pay attention to what that was about. I just knew people were complaining about it.

How is the second release different than the first release? And can you tell on the outside of the Blu-Ray sleeve? I’m going to have to research this.

It also includes all the digital and Target exclusive extras (plus a new deleted scene and a new featurette). And nicer/different packaging. And the 3D Blu-ray.

Thanks. I found it’s called ‘Star Wars: The Force Awakens – 3D Collector’s Edition’.

I’m going to pick up a copy. I knew there was a second release, but just heard complaints about it. I didn’t really pay attention because I really didn’t like TFA and was burned out on Star Wars because of that. I was planning on getting into all the new canon comics and read some of the books. But I abandoned that after seeing TFA.

It is a good commentary, I just listened to it a couple weeks ago.

There’s some really good new canon content out there. Whole thread for it here:
http://originaltrilogy.com/topic/Star-Wars-Official-Canon-Content-Thread/id/53868

Thanks for the link to that thread. I find this website’s forum structure to be confusing compared to all the other message boards I’ve been on. I hope they update it or something.

I still have a lot of digital Star Wars comics I still haven’t read. I found places selling digital codes to own those comics for like $1 a piece.

DominicCobb said:

Ryan said:

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

Matt.F said:

Looks like there is a thread for that so let me pose the question in a different way - “what was your least favourite scene or sequence in the film?”

Anyone can answer, and could be interesting to hear specific answers as many criticisms are broad ones.

For me, as much as I like BB8 I would happily say goodbye to the monocle alien feeding him coins and then the pay off scene of firing them at the guard. Also BB8 again, driving the Scout Walker didn’t work for me.

I’ve only seen it once. But my least favorite scene is Luke throwing his lightsaber behind his back in that joking manor. That’s the worst.

He wasn’t joking.

Well, whatever you want to call it. The tossing it behind his back in a goofy manor. It’s not just about being goofy, but also him tossing the lightsaber like it means nothing to him.

I get what they were trying to do. They were trying to have hermit Luke act like a goofball similar to how Yoda acted in Empire.

You don’t understand that scene at all, sorry.

Ok. I plan on watching it again next couple of weeks. And will watch it again on Blu-Ray. Also looking forward to the Johnson commentary track. Really wish JJ had done one

He did, it was the main selling point of the second release.

Oh, I never knew that. I bought the first release as soon as it was on the stores shelves. I did hear there was a second release, but didn’t really pay attention to what that was about. I just knew people were complaining about it.

How is the second release different than the first release? And can you tell on the outside of the Blu-Ray sleeve? I’m going to have to research this.

It also includes all the digital and Target exclusive extras (plus a new deleted scene and a new featurette). And nicer/different packaging. And the 3D Blu-ray.

Thanks. I found it’s called ‘Star Wars: The Force Awakens – 3D Collector’s Edition’.

I’m going to pick up a copy. I knew there was a second release, but just heard complaints about it. I didn’t really pay attention because I really didn’t like TFA and was burned out on Star Wars because of that. I was planning on getting into all the new canon comics and read some of the books. But I abandoned that after seeing TFA.

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

Matt.F said:

Looks like there is a thread for that so let me pose the question in a different way - “what was your least favourite scene or sequence in the film?”

Anyone can answer, and could be interesting to hear specific answers as many criticisms are broad ones.

For me, as much as I like BB8 I would happily say goodbye to the monocle alien feeding him coins and then the pay off scene of firing them at the guard. Also BB8 again, driving the Scout Walker didn’t work for me.

I’ve only seen it once. But my least favorite scene is Luke throwing his lightsaber behind his back in that joking manor. That’s the worst.

He wasn’t joking.

Well, whatever you want to call it. The tossing it behind his back in a goofy manor. It’s not just about being goofy, but also him tossing the lightsaber like it means nothing to him.

I get what they were trying to do. They were trying to have hermit Luke act like a goofball similar to how Yoda acted in Empire.

You don’t understand that scene at all, sorry.

Ok. I plan on watching it again next couple of weeks. And will watch it again on Blu-Ray. Also looking forward to the Johnson commentary track. Really wish JJ had done one

He did, it was the main selling point of the second release.

Oh, I never knew that. I bought the first release as soon as it was on the stores shelves. I did hear there was a second release, but didn’t really pay attention to what that was about. I just knew people were complaining about it.

I’m going to have to research this.

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

Matt.F said:

Looks like there is a thread for that so let me pose the question in a different way - “what was your least favourite scene or sequence in the film?”

Anyone can answer, and could be interesting to hear specific answers as many criticisms are broad ones.

For me, as much as I like BB8 I would happily say goodbye to the monocle alien feeding him coins and then the pay off scene of firing them at the guard. Also BB8 again, driving the Scout Walker didn’t work for me.

I’ve only seen it once. But my least favorite scene is Luke throwing his lightsaber behind his back in that joking manor. That’s the worst.

He wasn’t joking.

Well, whatever you want to call it. The tossing it behind his back in a goofy manor. It’s not just about being goofy, but also him tossing the lightsaber like it means nothing to him.

I get what they were trying to do. They were trying to have hermit Luke act like a goofball similar to how Yoda acted in Empire.

You don’t understand that scene at all, sorry.

Ok. I plan on watching it again next couple of weeks. And will watch it again on Blu-Ray. Also looking forward to the Johnson commentary track. Really wish JJ had done one or the actors or something on TFA.

TV’s Frink said:

Ryan said:

Matt.F said:

Looks like there is a thread for that so let me pose the question in a different way - “what was your least favourite scene or sequence in the film?”

Anyone can answer, and could be interesting to hear specific answers as many criticisms are broad ones.

For me, as much as I like BB8 I would happily say goodbye to the monocle alien feeding him coins and then the pay off scene of firing them at the guard. Also BB8 again, driving the Scout Walker didn’t work for me.

I’ve only seen it once. But my least favorite scene is Luke throwing his lightsaber behind his back in that joking manor. That’s the worst.

He wasn’t joking.

Well, whatever you want to call it. The tossing it behind his back in a goofy manor. It’s not just about being goofy, but also him tossing the lightsaber like it means nothing to him.

I get what they were trying to do. They were trying to have hermit Luke act like a goofball similar to how Yoda acted in Empire. It just didn’t work and I doubt anyone 2 years ago would have said that’s how they wanted that Rey/Luke scene to go to in TLJ.

Matt.F said:

Looks like there is a thread for that so let me pose the question in a different way - “what was your least favourite scene or sequence in the film?”

Anyone can answer, and could be interesting to hear specific answers as many criticisms are broad ones.

For me, as much as I like BB8 I would happily say goodbye to the monocle alien feeding him coins and then the pay off scene of firing them at the guard. Also BB8 again, driving the Scout Walker didn’t work for me.

I’ve only seen it once. But my least favorite scene is Luke throwing his lightsaber behind his back in that joking manor. That’s the worst. But the next worst is Poe joking around when talking to the Star Destroyer type ship. And Finn running around in that water suit.

DrDre said:

I think another poster said it before, that TLJ is both good and bad. It gives us some bold choices both in story and character, that defy expectations. At the same time franchises thrive on expectations by giving us more of the same with some new stuff sprinkled in. In a lot of ways the sameness defines a franchise. Do we really want something new? Do we want to see Indiana Jones grow old? Do we want to see Superman no longer able to fly? Do we want to see Spider-Man deny that with great power comes great responsibility? These are traits, that define these characters. Should a writer change Spider-Man’s character, or reveal previously unknown flaws, or should he create a new character, or a new story. These questions don’t have a right or wrong answer. One thing is for sure Star Wars is evolving at a faster rate than ever before.

I’m really wondering what’s going on with the Solo movie. As the word was the original director was making it too much like a comedy or something. And so they brought in Howard to re-shot a lot of the movie. I really hope they see the complaints of the comedy in TLJ and remove any of that in the Solo movie when they edit it and/or do pickup shots.

GlastoEls said:

Ryan said:

Also I was real lucky getting a good seat. I got there 30 minutes early and there already was a huge line inside.

Wait - you didn’t have assigned seats on the ticket?

No, my theater doesn’t do assigned seats. Which I like and don’t like. As I think I’m probably glad they don’t as many times I’ve had to move seats for various reasons. One time there was a really stinky person come in and sit by me. He stunk real bad. And so I moved to another seat. Sometimes I move because loud people are sitting close by, and so I’ll move to the other side of the theater. Sometimes I move because a family with a bunch of kids sit by me, and the kids won’t shut up.

On something else on topic. There have been times where I’ve left a show and got a refund because there was a person in the theater with a loud screaming baby. WTF? That’s happened many times. I just don’t get it. But there’s been many times in the past where I just couldn’t sit through an entire movie with a screaming baby and got a refund for a later showing. Though sometimes I’ve sit through a movie in the theater with a loud screaming baby. I just don’t get why people bring babies to the theater. I’ve complained a lot and told them to ban babies or something. I remember watching that 2008 Indiana Jones movie, and had to leave because of a screaming baby and come back for a later showing. It really sucks too because when I come back for the next showing. I have to re-buy my popcorn and drink. So a loud screaming baby can cost me $10 in food/drink.

On opening night Thursday, when I watched TLJ, there was a screw up in my theater. As when it started, there was a loud voice over commentator. i.e. the voice thing for blind people to explain what’s happening on the screen. The voice over didn’t read the crawl but talked about the crawl going up the screen.

Anyways, with the loud voice thing, I wasn’t able to read the crawl. It was like trying to read the crawl with a really loud voice talking about things. Luckily they cut that off after like 5 minutes going into the movie.

I plan on watching it again in like a week or so.

Also I was real lucky getting a good seat. I got there 30 minutes early and there already was a huge line inside. They said they had 80% of the tickets already sold and had cut it off. So when I got in the theater, I thought all of the seats in the middle and upper section were taken. But there was one open seat halfway up right in the middle. I kept seeing a bunch of people coming in pissed off not being to get a seat in the middle and upper sections.

I was thinking I was going to have to sit in the bottom section right in front of the screen. I’ve got stuck before in a packed theater and had to sit right in front of the screen. Really sucks as you have to tilt your head all the way back to look up at the screen. And it looks all weird and stretched because you are sitting too close.

nmr1723 said:

Ryan said:

Collipso said:

Honestly I think Hamill puts it in a much better way than any of us could.

https://youtu.be/hpu8pD9C-1s

Did you read through the comments in that video? Seems like every comment they are hating what Disney has done to Star Wars and hate what they did with Luke Skywalker. Even read some comments saying they think the prequels are better than the new Star Wars Disney movies.

I really think in 5-10 years you will see the level of hate of these Disney Star Wars movies like what happened with the prequels.

Internet commenters (especially Yahoo & YouTube) are the dregs of society right now. YouTube is part of my job (I help brands) and it doesn’t matter what type of content is put out, people will find a reason to crap all over it.

I feel the opposite for the ST. I think people will grow to like it even more. I disliked TPM after the crawl and I never recovered from it. I even got to see it in advance as my parents’ neighbor worked for Kenner. I was 21 at the time.

TFA and TLJ did not come close to this for me and it’s all because I truly care about the characters and not just Luke/Han/Leia. I understand this is all personal and subjective, but I don’t see these movies ever reaching prequel levels of hatred.

The new stuff may not get to prequel level hate later on. But we’ll find out in the future. The one advantage of the new movies is they have a lot better CGI than the prequels. So the prequels CGI looks really dated and I know one complaint people have on the prequels is the dated CGI and the crappy “green screen” backgrounds that weren’t done that well compared to today. Though the new Star Wars has some crappy CGI like Maz Kanata and that meat ball monster thing chasing Han Solo.

I still think it would have been better this new trilogy to not have the original main characters in it. I didn’t like the idea at first as Carry didn’t look good or seem like she could act good now, and she didn’t. But I warmed up to it expecting a badass Luke Skywalker kicking ass, but we really didn’t get any of that.

I’ve watched TPM probably 10+ times and I still don’t know what that movie is about.

dahmage said:

Ryan said:

Collipso said:

Honestly I think Hamill puts it in a much better way than any of us could.

https://youtu.be/hpu8pD9C-1s

Did you read through the comments in that video? Seems like every comment they are hating what Disney has done to Star Wars and hate what they did with Luke Skywalker. Even read some comments saying they think the prequels are better than the new Star Wars Disney movies.

I really think in 5-10 years you will see the level of hate of these Disney Star Wars movies like what happened with the prequels.

are you suggesting we take youtube comments as representative of the world at large? LOL

Not at all. But I was expecting to see a mix of hate/love type thing like we see on here. But it was 100% hate on the new Star Wars and what Disney did with Luke Skywalker.

Also, there are a lot of channels on Youtube who have commentary on Star Wars over the years. And I can remember many many of them talking about how they originally loved the prequels, but years later realized that they were really crap. And then those same commentators now are all loving the new Star Wars movies. And I just think years down the road, history will repeat and they’ll say they originally liked the new Star Wars but now (future) realize they are crap.

I’ve got some channels on Youtube to check out who flipped on liking and later hating the prequels. And I’ll check out their TLJ review and check out the comments section to see where people are.

Collipso said:

Honestly I think Hamill puts it in a much better way than any of us could.

https://youtu.be/hpu8pD9C-1s

Did you read through the comments in that video? Seems like every comment they are hating what Disney has done to Star Wars and hate what they did with Luke Skywalker. Even read some comments saying they think the prequels are better than the new Star Wars Disney movies.

I really think in 5-10 years you will see the level of hate of these Disney Star Wars movies like what happened with the prequels.

I’m really glad that Finn wasn’t annoying in TLJ, other than wearing that stupid water suit scene. I think TFA is a badly edited and directed movie, not counting the bad story. But I also found TFA painfully to watch because Finn was so annoying throughout the whole movie. i.e. like him running around screaming and you also could hear his voice breaking into his British accent.

But I don’t like TLJ, but I think it will be easy to sit and watch multiple of times compared to TFA.

I really wish JJ wasn’t coming back for Episode 9. Really wish they had gotten someone else. But oh well.

ChainsawAsh said:

adywan said:

ChainsawAsh said:

One other thing I’ll say about my second viewing:

Puppet Yoda looked a TON better than I remembered from my first viewing, but every time the fire was directly on his face, he looked weird. I don’t think I’ll have a problem with TLJ puppet Yoda the way I did TPM’s.

The thing i did notice though was how the pupeteers squashed his face up way too much when they closed his mouth, which gave him this strange “puffed out cheeks with no mouth” look

Yep, this right here is the only problem that I still have with TLJ Yoda. Noticed it both times, but everything else looked fine (bar the occasionally weird lighting) the second time around.

Same theater both times for me, though…weird.

Do you think Disney will fix this via CGI for the Blu-Ray?

I’m wondering if Disney has or will tinker with their Star Wars movies like Lucas did and change things for the Blu-Ray release?

This is one of the bad things about not having a recording of the theatrical version to be able to compare to the Blu-Ray release.

I don’t know how many times I’ve watched a movie on Blu-Ray, and I know they’ve changed things from what I saw in the theater. i.e. they use different takes and re-edit it. I even remember the movie ‘A Series of Unfortunate Events’ in the theater and the boom mic kept dropping down into the picture all throughout the movie. Then on the DVD release, they must have digitally removed the boom mic as I didn’t see it drop into picture like in the theater.

DrDre said:

Matt.F said:

And if we are using wiki, then this clarifies that Leia was a force ‘USER’ prior to A New Hope, when she apparently saved a girl from falling off a balcony.

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Leia_Organa_Solo

Shall we continue DrDre?

Oke, a history lesson. Star Wars was a film released in 1977, while it’s sequels were released in 1980 and 1983.

Leia saved that girl in the book “The Last of the Jedi: Master of Deception” released in 2008.

I’m sure you’re understanding where I’m going with this. If a new books comes out that claims Leia has wings, this doesnt in any way imply that Geoge Lucas envisioned Leia with wings when he made the films.

However, as I stated earlier, you’re whole argument against my statement that Snoke forgot to use his mind reading powers for plot convenience, hinged on the flawed idea that the OT was equally contrived, because Vader did not use mind reading powers on Antilles and Leia.

Applying retro-active continuity and your own words, Vader did attempt to use mind reading on Leia, but failed, and used old fashioned torture to get the information from Antilles.

So, my criticism against Snoke still stands, while your counter argument has been debunked.

Shall we continue, Matt F.?

I don’t think in OT that Vader could read minds. But obviously Disney now says that force users CAN read minds.

So I think it’s best to just stick with what we see in the OT movies, and nothing in it says that Vader can “read minds”.

I know there are “canon” comic books that have been coming out that are taking place during the OT. Does any of that have Vader “reading minds”?

If Disney retcons the OT rules, then I guess you’ll have to decide to believe what’s in the OT movies, or believe what Disney has retconned. Though I’m not saying that Disney has “retconned” that Vader can “read minds”.

But at this point, it’s either in the movies, or has been retconned by Disney with the new comic books and books that are out.

I’ve not seen anyone post something from “canon” that has Vader “reading minds”. I don’t know, maybe it’s in a new comic book or book that Disney has put out.

Let’s say if Disney put out a comic book that has Luke “flying around like Superman” during the OT, then you’d have to decide if you believe what you see in the OT movies, or what Disney has retconned.

ChainsawAsh said:

One other thing I’ll say about my second viewing:

Puppet Yoda looked a TON better than I remembered from my first viewing, but every time the fire was directly on his face, he looked weird. I don’t think I’ll have a problem with TLJ puppet Yoda the way I did TPM’s.

I think Yoda looks “weird” in TLJ. But yes, he looks a lot better than the puppet in TPM. I was actually glad that Lucas CGI’d in a Yoda for TPM Blu-Ray. So I’ll never again have to see the Yoda puppet in TPM.

adywan said:

The Mind Probe is also a jedi power in canon. Who is to say which one he was talking about? 😉 If someone can say that Luke transmitted his thoughts to Vader, instead of vader reading his mind, then i can say that the mind probe that he was talking about is also the established jedi Mind Probe 😉

And, if we are using wiki, this clears up that Vader was using the mind probe (thus reading Luke’;s mind) in ROTJ 😉
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Mind_probe_(Force_power)

I read through your link. I don’t know who wrote all of that stuff. But obviously we know with Disney take over that Kylo could “read minds”.

The question is if in OT that Vader could “read minds”. And there’s nothing in those movies to say that he can.

Also, the fact is in ANH that the “mind probe” was that black round floating ball. Everyone has understood that to be true. I’ve always thought that.

Now, we’re not talking about someone later on retconning the thing. So we’re talking about what was true in 1983.

adywan said:

Ryan said:

The OT doesn’t establish that Vader can “read minds”. It’s actually the opposite with Vader having to resort to torture to find out information others have.

So, my theory of what’s going on in the OT is supported by what we see in the OT movies.

It was established that Vader could read minds in ANH. The Mind probe is a Jedi ability to go through peoples minds in order to get useful information. That’s pretty much reading someone’s mind right there. Vader even said in ANH that “Her resistance to the mind probe is considerable” . And he wasn’t talking about the interrogator droid either. that ability was established in the OT. Just because he didn’t just read everyones mind doesn’t mean to say he couldn’t do it. We have seen Jedi have abilities then just don’t use them when they really could do with using them ( jedi speed run, super jump, mind control etc etc) .

The “mind probe” in ANH was that black round floating ball. Someone posted a picture of it up above.

Do you not know the “mind probe” is a physical object?

Matt.F said:

Ryan said:
But let me ask, with all of the interviews that Lucas has done. Has he ever said that OT Vader could “read minds”?

Yes, it’s referenced in A New Hope during the Death Star conference the officer says '‘Your sad devotion to that ancient religion hasn’t helped you conjure up the stolen data tapes or given you clairvoyance enough to find the rebels’ hidden fortress."

Vader also states that Leia’s “resistance to the mind probe is considerable”.

This backs up exactly what Adywan has said - that those with the Force are actually BETTER at resisting mind probing than those without. It is the opposite of this convoluted nonsense that DrDre has been tying himself in knots trying to justify.

If you want an in-universe explanation, then yes Vader does have clairvoyance, but no - after all his injuries he just isn’t very good at it!

The stuff you mention here doesn’t tell me or provide evidence that Vader can “read minds”.

The “mind probe” was that black round floating ball thing. I don’t see how you connect that to evidence of “Vader can read minds”.

And I don’t take “clairvoyance” to mean that Vader can “read minds”.

There’s just not any evidence or dialogue in the OT that says Vader can “read minds”.

But that doesn’t mean you or anyone can or can not believe that Vader CAN “read minds”. Just the same as someone could believe that Luke could “fly” because they saw him jump really high in Empire while fighting Vader.

Collipso said:

DrDre said:

Collipso said:

DrDre said:

This film is really a number of great scenes held together by a terrible plot filled with story contrivances.

This is actually a pretty accurate description; I still love it though.

Hey, I enjoyed it also, and it has some great stuff. I would describe it as a pretty good movie, but only a below average Star Wars film, because of the outlined problems, which mostly relate to how it fits in the saga as a whole.

As a movie I think it has major problems, such as a “ticking clock” that sacrificed moments that would otherwise be extremely important for character development. The flow of scenes in the first act didn’t feel right, and the pace (because of subplots) and tone (because of the excessive jokes) of the movie both felt off. Just my opinion though.

I’m surprised they let that humor in TLJ knowing how most of us hated the “humor” in the prequels. I didn’t like the movie, but I’d have liked the movie “more” if it didn’t have the crap humor in it.

I’ve been wanting to build a New Hope Luke Skywalker lightsaber with those “Yoda” Kyber crystal chamber inside. I think those things are cool, but seem to be pricey. But I’ve been wanting to do that for many years now. But in The Last Jedi, I think Luke disrespects that lightsaber. And he treats it like it’s a piece of crap or something. And it’s just kind of a turn off of building a lightsaber now.

I used to have one of those FX Luke A New Hope lightsabers many years ago. The one where you can remove the blade. I believe the newer ones don’t let you remove the blade.

Does anyone know who built the Empire Strikes Back Luke lightsaber for these new movies? I’m wondering if this was built in Disney or Lucasfilm? Or if they outsourced it to a fan club thing like they did with R2-D2?

I have to say even though I don’t like how they treated the lightsaber in TLJ, I wouldn’t mind owning the lightsaber prop, even the one that was tore in two. Mainly because I’d want to see how they did a Kyber crystal chamber thing inside. I’ll have to wait until the Blu-Ray to pause and see if it shows on screen the inside of the lightsaber when it’s torn in two.

adywan said:

So Force users can manipulate non-force users to make them say or do what they want , but they can’t read their minds, yet can read the mind pretty easily of a trained force user? yeh, that seems logical and believable 😉

And, yes Vader DID read luke’s mind in ROTJ. “You’re thoughts betray you. You’re feelings for them are clear, especially…sister…” all this while Luke is trying hard to block Vader from accessing this thoughts. If you think Luke just let all that slip out and projected that direct to Vader, then that really diminishes his character and makes him a very weak individual and a crap jedi. It’s been clear to almost everyone since 1983 that Vader read Luke’s mind. Yet this has only now come up in an poor attempt to say how crap TLJ is.

I can understand your viewpoint on this. The “You’re thoughts betray you.” I think of that as Luke thinking out loud while he was telepathically talking with Vader. I view it as Vader prodding Luke to get him to reveal his secrets, and then Luke trying to not think about Leia and keep it a secret, but he can’t and thinks it out loud while Vader is telepathically listening to him.

The OT doesn’t establish that Vader can “read minds”. It’s actually the opposite with Vader having to resort to torture to find out information others have.

So, my theory of what’s going on in the OT is supported by what we see in the OT movies.

But let me ask, with all of the interviews that Lucas has done. Has he ever said that OT Vader could “read minds”?

I still think it was a waste with a force projection Luke fighting Kylo Ren. In the moment on first watching before we knew it was a fake force projection, it was like “What’s going on here?”. But I think a “real” Luke should have fought Kylo. As force projection Luke feels empty. I think on repeated viewings in the future, this fight scene will feel real empty and doesn’t give a fulfillment to the conflict between Luke and Kylo.

Imagine if in Return of the Jedi, that we find out at the end that a fake projection Luke or a fake projection Vader was really fighting the other? It would feel real empty.

Or say in A New Hope, that we end up finding out that Obi-Wan was sitting in a closet somewhere on the Death Star. And that he used a force projection to fake fight with Vader, and then Obi-Wan just disappeared. It wouldn’t have a fulfillment like what we got with a REAL Obi-Wan fighting a REAL Vader.