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DarthJedi

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23-May-2014
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11-Oct-2015
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Post
#709584
Topic
If we watch them in order... ...
Time

Guys... Are you freaking kidding? The head bung was just a joke, a reference, that should not be taken seriously. If you take everything seriously, then the alien from E.T. is a part of SW, because there are few of them in the background in the Senate. But why are they really there? It's an "easter egg", a joke. Don't forget that Star Wars are MOVIES, a fiction, not a freaking documentary.

Post
#707763
Topic
If we watch them in order... ...
Time

   RAAAAGE!!!!  I just made a long-er post and the damn thing glitched out! I go to the Dark Side! But first, the question...

   As far as I know clones life can be up to two times shorter than regular humans. Aging process might slow down when they are in their prime, but once they start getting old, aging goes back to fast, or can even become faster than before because of factors like stress. It was Kaminoans way to make clones, there were other. This way was just fine for Sidious' plan, and if not for Kaminos cloners uprising, he'd be making new generations.

  Clones kept serving as Stromtroopers after CW, while younger ones were trained to become them until all was shut. As for new recruits, clones were very displeased with them. Clone CC-2224, older CW veteran, would call new troopers idiots who embarrass once remarkable military force.

   For me OT the non-clone Stormtroopers are like Separatists Battle Droids: not very efficient, but are dangerous because of large numbers.

Post
#707737
Topic
If we watch them in order... ...
Time

Guys, think about all the "badass" clone troopers in II and III. In II it was said that they age twice faster than normal human. So for clones it wasn't 20 years between III and IV, it was 40. Most of them were 20 "clone years" in Ep.II. Now add 40, we got 60, and that isn't a prime age for a soldier. So only young clones, made during  Clone Wars, would become Stormproopers later. So there are two explanations to most Stormtroopers to be not as good: ether the new army of clones wasn't nearly as good as original, or most of them are not clones at all.

EU stated that the cloning facilities were shut down after cloners uprising, which means that only some of the Imperial Stortroopers are clones, while majority are regular humans, who aren't nearly as good.

Post
#707322
Topic
If we watch them in order... ...
Time

Good point. Even in reality there are many countries, and even some states in which it's not forbidden, so yeah. *whistle?* :)

Post
#707286
Topic
If we watch them in order... ...
Time

Hey, ROTJ stated that they are siblings. Once you watch ROTJ, you won't be able to look at it the same way :))  Thank Obi-Wan and his secrets. Well, at least Luke and Leia had just a kiss and didn't take it any further, that would make things re-e-e-...-a-a-ally awkward O_o 

Post
#707273
Topic
If we watch them in order... ...
Time

To Tobar, about "old enough to be found in a junkyard":

1) So what about it? Seems like these droids were around for a long time.

2)As it's known, Anakin found parts, not a whole broken droid at once. So lets say that someone had his 3PO fixed, and trows out a part. Then another person does the same, but with different part. Watto had huge junk yard, so it probably had a lot of stuff. It's also believed that Anakin might have... ahem... "borrowed" some parts from actual shop (at the background in Watto's store you can see a protocol droid with missing parts).

This post has been edited.

Post
#707267
Topic
If we watch them in order... ...
Time

Hello everyone :)

WARNING: Its not a list of problems, but explanations to the "problems" that have been listed above. Also the way I've seen them is: I, II, IV, V, VI, III (since I started with I, but had to wait for III for some time to come out). 

-Revelation of Jabba: back when ROTJ came out, it was revelation (wothout huge focus on itself, but still). Nowadays Star Wars are everywhere, so Jabba is well known. When I talk to some people who haven't seen SW, and ask if they know Jabba, they might say "that fat worm-ish guy?". SW are too big nowadays to keep any revelations in OT (at least not at the same level), and it would mean not using Hutts in any other SW product, which is unlikely.

-Training equipment on Falcon: Kenobi had lightsaber (obviously), found some dirty helmet, which is NOT like the one that younglings were using, which is not difficult. So all that's left is training droid, which is small and he could have taken it to train Luke while going to Alderaan and then later (he didn't really plan to be cut by Vader, you know)

-What are Jedi? What's the Force? When I watched Ep.I the way I understood was that Jedi are these dudes with lightsabers and "magic" who maintain peace, and the Force is the "magic" they use to use Force push, be super fast, feel life around, etc. I only got confused by "Sith" a bit, thinking at first that Zabraks are Sith, but with Ep.II it became clear that Sith are "bad Jedi".

-Why in Ep.VI no one is mentioning that Anakin is the chosen one? As we see in Ep.III Jedi have lost their faith in this prophesy.

-Anakin did NOT invent protocol droids, you can see one on the ship of Trade Federation. Darth Vader didn't talk to 3PO even once. He only saw some broken protocol droid with Chewbacca, and 3PO couldn't recognize him ether for obvious reasons (although in some EU comicbook Vader had a flashback to 3PO when he saw him, I believe, but nothing more). There are no positives or negatives in "Anankin built 3PO", just Lucas' fetish for "rhyming in storytelling".

-Owen doesn't recognize 3PO or doesn't even mention him. First is that, indeed, there are hundreds if not thousands of protocol droids and astro-droids, and 3PO looks very different and had memory wipe. And he had only seed R2 once. Why not mentioning it? To whom? Beru? She knows it herself. To Luke? Mentioning that "that droid is kinda like the one your dad had", while trying to avoid conversations about Luke's dad? I don't think so.

-Obi-Wan said that Jedi knights have been guardians of Republic for thousand generations, while Palpatine was referring to the fact that the Republic has been whole for 1000 years, when there were no grand scale wars. Although the way it's said can indeed create confusion, especially in EU.

-D-rings on lightsabers: the design of a lightsaber is just a personal preference.

-Obi-Wan owned R4 unit and that one was destroyed 20 years ago, during battle of Coruscant. Other than that, Ben is one lying individual... or rather one with "certain point of view"

-Palpatine is NOT Anakin's father. Anakin was indeed created by the Force, but only because Darth Plagues and Darth Sidious (not sure if Darth Tenebrous has anything to do with it, but whatever) were able to shift the balance of the Force, believing themselves to be above it in a way. Force clearly didn't like it and created a man who's destiny was to destroy them (Plageous was already killed by Sidious, so only one remained) and restore the balance.

Hope it was helpful :)

This post has been edited.

Post
#707260
Topic
Flaws, plotholes, and "could-have-been-done-betters" in the OT (alternate plot points especially welcome)
Time

^I thought about it, but that's not the point. The point is that still is a rare weapon that still is strongly associated with Jedi, and it doesn't seem like a good idea to use it when Imperial troopers are around. Just imagine that troopers came into the bar just 5-10 minutes earlier and saw a lightsaber. They'd probably stop them to at least question, or try to arrest right away. Obi-Wan could probably brainwash them again, but even this power has limits, since when he saw that troopers were coming in the bar, he decided to leave right away. Now imagine if troopers reported to Vader (who as we know used to hunt down remaining Jedi). Just imagine if instead of only troopers we also got Vader coming to docking bay 94 if he made it in time. My point is that it's a HUGE risk just to deal with some a-hole in a bar, not too clever for a hiding Jedi.

The real reason for it I think is... it's a movie, and it's more entertaining to see.

One more thing that is head scratching if we take OT on it's own.  Luke lives with his aunt and uncle, right? But we don't know how they are related. From the way they talk about Anakin (Beru calling him as simply "Lukes father", not "my brother" or anything) we can assume that Owen is Vader's brother (or at very least in-laws). So they HIDE Luke from Vader... at his brother's home. We can only assume that Vader can't give less turds about brother, but nothing more, for a reason why Vader doesn't visit him or anything. With prequels however we see that 1)they are step-brothers and hardly know each other personally 2)Anakin had only bad memories related to Owen and Beru (Shmi's death). So within 6 episodes, we clearly see the reason why Vader doesn't visit brother on Christmas :)

This post has been edited.

Post
#707191
Topic
Flaws, plotholes, and "could-have-been-done-betters" in the OT (alternate plot points especially welcome)
Time

Hello :)

-Mind Trick: It's a part of my "Stormtroopers kinda suck" problem. Although we can assume that Obi-Wan persuaded whole group, it still is just an assumption, and while I can accept it for explanation, there still are moments like "locked door" or inability to deal with a primitive tribe. The point is... Stormtroopers kinda suck, yeah...   :)

-Although it doesn't bug me too much with uniforms, still, there are hundreds if not thousands of troopers on DS. They don't use clones anymore looking at all 6, and if we just look at OT it only adds up to it: it's unlikely that every Stormtrooper knows each others face, so might be useful even without helmets (or could get them later). Could at least try to be all "yeah, here they are, we caught them, let us take them to cells" or something. :)  But I let this one slip, it really doesn't bother me to be honest. After all these are sci-fi adventure movies, not stealth spy or something.

-The swords: Yeah, clearly the Force improves their performance so they could use sword against guns. But originals don't show it nearly as well as PT. Lukes opponents with guns were "drunk" Boba and Stormtrooper (who are separate case), we also see Vader using his hands to block shots, which is cool, but 1)he is "level 80 dark lord" 2) he has only 2 hands, what if there were many guys shooting at once? Say whatever you want, but in PT, when we see Jedi taking out their lightsaber against a group (not an army like in II or III) of regular opponents with guns we're like "oh, guys, you're screwed, better drop guns and give up". Just on their own Originals don't give enough to clearly see that Jedi with a sword can kick major @ss against guns, we mostly assume it. So the actual "complain" is that it would be nicer to see real "Jedi at work", whether by Obi-Wan (when he was still alive) or by trained Luke, not for the sake of pure action, but to see how the hell did it work in the old Republic.

-Walkers: Yeah, why not something flying, or something with wheels? Something that can't be taken down by a rope. Also rebels say that Walkers armor is too strong for their blasters, but apparently it's not once the walker fell down, which is strange. But lets be serious, the real reason is that these machines look cool, like something non-Earth, something more alien. Movies are entertainment after all, even when they are thought provoking.

-Yoda: Surprisingly I get this part the best after watching Prequels and Clone Wars (Season 6), because Originals state that there's this cave that is strong with the Force (Dark Side in this case), they don't really state that entire planet Dagobah is strong. Yoda, living among such concentration of Force is invisible for Sith, keeping himself as one of last Jedi, as a teacher for Anakin's children. But I base this greatly on Prequel storyline. With Originals one can assume that Yoda is pacifist (as you just did) or too old (but isn't it just a body, which shouldn't matter?). With PT and CW we see that only Yoda and Kenobi were able to become Force Ghosts (Jinn was mostly just a voice), and that it was a rather new thing and thus they couldn't guarantee that it'll work, thus Yoda needed to be alive to teach for sure. If we had only OT it'd be safe to assume that all Jedi can do it. And if so why not spend last years of your body's existence to help fight the evil (not take down the Empire, just help; he was "a great warrior" after all) and then train Luke as a ghost (Kenobi was totally capable of providing wisdom after his death). So this complain is not a complain within full saga, but if we take only the OT, then it becomes a "head scratch".

This post has been edited.

Post
#707110
Topic
Flaws, plotholes, and "could-have-been-done-betters" in the OT (alternate plot points especially welcome)
Time

Hello everyone :)

Although I like all SW movies, I understand that there are quite few head scratching parts. Surprisingly there are more of them in OT for me than PT. Anyway here's my personal list (sorry if I missed the explanations):

*NEW HOPE:*

-Leia's lack of emotions concerning the destruction of her home planet with her family, friends, pets, etc. I understand that she has to be strong and all, but she doesn't even remember about it, not even ONCE in entire trilogy.

-Luke and Obi-Wan see nothing bad about leaving a droid who is carrying an extremely important information that can save billions outside the bar, knowing really well that the Stormtroopers are outside, searching. They even met them only few minutes ago, really close to the bar.

-Stormtroopers... Idiots. "Knocking on the door, locked, ok lets go then" thing. To hide from the evil empire... just lock the door. Also what were other troopers doing while Obi-Wan was Force persuading one of them? Just standing without finding anything suspicious. Ok.

-Why did Solo and Luke throw out Stormtroopers armor, their disguise? Because it stinks after trash? After trash compactor all their clothes should stink. Go to bathroom (should be on DS), wash, there you have some disguise back.

-Leia believes that the Empire is tracking Falcon, so... she goes right to the hidden rebel base instead of meeting with an agent, search for bugs, or figure out any other way to send the plans.

-Empire knows that rebels got the plans to the Death Star and know it's only weakness, so.... they do nothing about it. Seriously, why not cover the hole? Place ships over it? Board it up at least? No? Nothing? Ok.

-Death Star has only a handful of small fighters on it, although the ONLY weak point of DS1 is a small shaft that could use protection from smaller fighters. 

-Why flying in the trench of DS instead of flying directly to the pipe?

-Obi-Wan is hiding from the empire. Changes his name... but not the last name. And becomes local "weird guy" people know, all while still wearing Jedi robes (as we later saw in Return of the Jedi).

-Obi-Wan said that Jedi were using swords as a weapon. Sword against gun? We see how it works in Prequels, and it worked ok when Luke was fighting bunch of Jabba's people, but they weren't too efficient (even Boba, who was wasted in an extremely stupid way), or one trooper, but what if there are ten enemies with guns?

EMPIRE STRIKES BACK:

-It's been 3 years by cannon and Han still haven't payed Jabba? No wonder Hutt is pissed.

-Why flying in the direction of Empire fleet when the planet is round and space is limitless?

-Why empire is using walkers on a flat surface? They can be good on bad ways, with obstacles, but flat surface? Also they can be defeated by a strong rope. (But hey, they look cool.)

-Yoda is an extremely powerful Jedi, but won't take part in war due to... what? He could use Force in battles, stopping entire ships. Too old? Body doesn't matter, right? Damn, even in prequels Yoda told his old body to f-off and increased it's strength for a short time with a Force to fight. But he won't fught the Empire anymore because... destiny?

-Luke going to Cloud City. Yoda and Obi-Wan don't want him to go, saying that he is not ready and can be killed or turned by Vader. They don't tell the truth about Vader, although it's clear that it is just another possible reason for Luke to join him if Vader tells, what he actually does. Now imagine if Luke wasn't hanging above the shaft, but was cornered instead. The choice would have been between joining the father, only known family he had at the moment, or getting killed. Another thing about it is that Yoda says that if necessary Luke should sacrifice Han, Chewbacca and... Leia?! The "other" last hope? Even if Lucas was not going in Leia is sister way while making ESB, now we are looking at original TRILOGY, which is "flawless". So... kinda foolish, Yoda.

RETURN OF THE JEDI:

-By cannon it's been a year, right? Well, they weren't in a hurry to save Han.

-Why sending the generals of rebellion to save him personally instead of soldiers, or hiring professionals like bounty hunters who seem to have an easy access to Jabba? Honestly I am fine with this one, it's so we could watch the heroes of film having an adventure, not someone unknown, but I add it anyway.

-What the hell was Luke's plan to save Han? Why giving the sword to R2 if Luke wasn't going to give out weapons or anything like it anyway? He even Force chocked Gamoreans, so what's the point of hiding it in R2? It'd be great to have facing Jabba (and of course the rancor). What if Jabba ordered memory wipe for droids? Why sending in Leia to send Han, because even if she succeeded, they still would have to save droids? Bunch other questions, but I think you get the point. Lucas himself admitted that this "plan" was so the movie was longer, because the original script was too short. But hey, we have Leia in bikini, right?

-As I said before, Boba gets "flushed in a toiled".

-Luke knows that Leia has Force power, because she is his sister, which sounds awfully biological (and biology in Force makes fans of originals go crazy, just remember midi-chlorians, that were assigned the status of the Force by them only, but not by a single character in actual movies). And Luke turns out to be right, Leia IS strong in the Force... but somehow Vader wasn't able to sense in when she was standing right next to him earlier on Death Star and in Cloud City.

-The Emperor. Although he is one of my favorite characters in all saga, his actions in Ep.VI are questionable. So he wanted to lure rebels into trap. Good. But was it really necessary to give them real info on the new Death Star? Some fake info would be just as good, as long as they go where they are needed.

With great Force powers that allow him to foresee the future, he surely missed a lot, including a whole army of lethal rocks-throwing teddy bears (which can be a separate thing on the list).

And finally what was his plan to turn Luke into his servant? Turn him to the Dark Side by angering him? Ok, but even if that worked and Luke has turned, and even killed Vader in anger, why would he serve the Emperor and help him destroy the rebellion (friends)? Wouldn't he rather use the dark power (if fallen) to kill the asshole? Or Dark Side suddenly means serving him?

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