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Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo — Page 540

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Warbler said:

moviefreakedmind said:

because nobody wants to see any of these people topless.

Nobody? Pretty sure some men want to see women topless.

I can’t believe that I have to point this out, but nudity outside of very specific contexts is incredibly unattractive.

The Person in Question

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DominicCobb said:

chyron8472 said:

yhwx said:

chyron8472 said:

Citing equality doesn’t really fit, because they are not equal. Saying a woman should be paid as much as a man because a woman’s ability or intelligence is equal is not the same thing as saying women’s bodies, which are not identical to men’s, should be treated identically. Having a woman cover her breasts does not lower her social standing or make her to be inferior to a man.

Let’s turn the tables. Is the argument that a certain part of a man’s body should be censored because it’s different from that part on a woman a valid argument to you?

I don’t think it is censored because it different. I think there are reasons other than simply it being different as to why it is censored, and those reasons are potentially sound.

Women’s breasts aren’t just different-and-that’s-it. Men have sexual responses to them. Women have clothing that accentuates them. Women and men both treat women’s physical bodies differently than women and men both treat men’s bodies. Women have different attractions to men than men do to women, and so arguing that men’s bodies and women’s bodies should be treated equally (or identically) “because” isn’t reason enough to not treat the differently.

You don’t think women have sexual responses to men’s exposed chests?

are now going to try to tell me that women’s sexual responses to men’s exposed chests = men’s sexual responses to women’s exposed chests?

Part of the reason why men have such pent up attraction to breasts is by the nature that most of the time they are concealed - if they were more common place, this wouldn’t necessarily be the case.

um, no. It is not just because they are covered up most of the time. It is also due to biology, it is just the way our bodies work.

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yhwx said:

What is found attractive is different throughout the world as well.

Not that differently.

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TV’s Frink said:

With that said, I don’t think women everywhere should suddenly go topless.

sexist! How dare you suggest we should continue this oppression of women!

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Warbler said:

DominicCobb said:

chyron8472 said:

yhwx said:

chyron8472 said:

Citing equality doesn’t really fit, because they are not equal. Saying a woman should be paid as much as a man because a woman’s ability or intelligence is equal is not the same thing as saying women’s bodies, which are not identical to men’s, should be treated identically. Having a woman cover her breasts does not lower her social standing or make her to be inferior to a man.

Let’s turn the tables. Is the argument that a certain part of a man’s body should be censored because it’s different from that part on a woman a valid argument to you?

I don’t think it is censored because it different. I think there are reasons other than simply it being different as to why it is censored, and those reasons are potentially sound.

Women’s breasts aren’t just different-and-that’s-it. Men have sexual responses to them. Women have clothing that accentuates them. Women and men both treat women’s physical bodies differently than women and men both treat men’s bodies. Women have different attractions to men than men do to women, and so arguing that men’s bodies and women’s bodies should be treated equally (or identically) “because” isn’t reason enough to not treat the differently.

You don’t think women have sexual responses to men’s exposed chests?

are now going to try to tell me that women’s sexual responses to men’s exposed chests = men’s sexual responses to women’s exposed chests?

And now you’re suddenly the expert on women’s sexual response to men’s bodies.

Part of the reason why men have such pent up attraction to breasts is by the nature that most of the time they are concealed - if they were more common place, this wouldn’t necessarily be the case.

um, no. It is not just because they are covered up most of the time. It is also due to biology, it is just the way our bodies work.

A little bit, but there are different standards of beauty around the world. In other cultures, female breasts aren’t considered nearly as erotic as they are in the Western world. The ideal weight for a man and a woman also changes around the world. It’s not just biology. It’s culture too.

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Warbler said:

yhwx said:

What is found attractive is different throughout the world as well.

Not that differently.

Source?

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Warbler said:

TV’s Frink said:

With that said, I don’t think women everywhere should suddenly go topless.

sexist! How dare you suggest we should continue this oppression of women!

You’re making absolutely no sense now.

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Possessed said:

How about everybody should wear a top when in public? Can we just agree on that and let it go?

Do you wear a top when you go swimming?

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yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

You know, I’m starting to think this thread was a better idea than y’all said it was.

Because it somehow helped?

Not that I can see.

It could have helped.

By getting more diverse people to join the forum?

The thread could have diagnosed the problems that are getting more diverse people to not join the forum, and therefore, put the structures in place that would help more of them join the forum.

And as I said, discussions about diversity are useful. It raises awareness about the issue, which is important.

Its a Star Wars forum. Its not going to attract women.

That’s a problem.

Its a problem a that this place is a Star Wars forum or that Star Wars just doesn’t attract women?

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Warbler said:

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

You know, I’m starting to think this thread was a better idea than y’all said it was.

Because it somehow helped?

Not that I can see.

It could have helped.

By getting more diverse people to join the forum?

The thread could have diagnosed the problems that are getting more diverse people to not join the forum, and therefore, put the structures in place that would help more of them join the forum.

And as I said, discussions about diversity are useful. It raises awareness about the issue, which is important.

Its a Star Wars forum. Its not going to attract women.

That’s a problem.

Its a problem a that this place is a Star Wars forum or that Star Wars just doesn’t attract women?

The latter.

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Warbler said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

You know, I’m starting to think this thread was a better idea than y’all said it was.

Because it somehow helped?

Not that I can see.

It could have helped.

By getting more diverse people to join the forum?

The thread could have diagnosed the problems that are getting more diverse people to not join the forum, and therefore, put the structures in place that would help more of them join the forum.

And as I said, discussions about diversity are useful. It raises awareness about the issue, which is important.

Its a Star Wars forum. Its not going to attract women.

I’m not even going to read any farther to see if anyone else responded yet.

What the fuck, man?

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chyron8472 said:

Women’s bodies are treated differently than men’s bodies, in part, because men are physically and hormonally affected differently by physical appearance than women and because American culture at large grew out of a more puritanical lifestyle.

I don’t care much about what affects people, I don’t care about culture, and I don’t care about puritanical lifestyles. I also really hate the idea of acting differently in order to shield someone that you don’t even know from something harmless that they don’t have to look at or listen to. Most people are pretty stupid too, so should we make sure everything that we say is comprehensible to an incredibly stupid person? By this logic we should.

To say that things should change because they’ve always been the same is equally as arbitrary as saying that things should remain the same for the same reason.

I think things should change when there is no logic behind the existing standard.

Just because you are progressive and believe women should not have to wear swimsuits that cover their breasts, that does not make their acceptance by the culture objectively wrong and worthy of change. As far as not wearing a bra, I’ve been married long enough to know that there is something to be said for the support they give with regard to any amount of exercise.

I’m not progressive and don’t really care about any of this. I just don’t like the argument behind your side.

Warbler said:

TV’s Frink said:

“A woman’s body isn’t treated as anymore obscene than a man’s.”
“Tell that to the top half of a woman’s body.”

How is this a confusing or controversial response? Is it wrong? Men can walk around without a shirt, women can’t.

female breasts = private part private parts need to be covered up. how is that confusing?

This is possibly the most juvenile thing that you’ve ever said on this forum. Funnily enough, I actually agree with you that “private parts,” if that’s what we have to call them (I didn’t realize we were six year-olds), should be covered. Let’s be honest, most peoples’ private parts are quite gross looking and should be covered. In appropriate areas, like pools and beaches, there’s no reason for men not to have to cover their chests while women do. It’s an arbitrary double standard. The reason you refuse to explain the rationale behind your thinking is because there is none. So go ahead and go on refusing to elaborate beyond repeating that you’re right without using proper capitalization or punctuation.

The Person in Question

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yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

There is a particular male-centered-ness to Warbler’s and chyron’s arguments. Why does the male body have to be the standard that we measure women against?

It’s not unreasonable.

No its ridiculous. I am not using the male body as the standard that we measure women against. There is nothing male-centered about my argument. Many women also agree that the female breasts should be covered.

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Warbler said:

TV’s Frink said:

Handman said:

Frink, you wouldn’t have any issue if your wife or daughter walked around topless?

Nowhere did I say I think women should walk around topless.

You sure seemed to be implying it. Why shouldn’t women walk around topless if men can? You should tell your female family members to do so, you don’t want to oppress them do you?

I merely disputed Warb’s assertion that men’s and women’s bodies are treated equally.

They are treated equally, they just have different private parts.

Jesus Christ, this is so goddamn stupid it makes me want to throw my computer into a volcano. Women’s breasts and men’s breasts are not treated equal. I’ve said so like eight times and you keep fucking either not getting it or ignoring it. That’s all I ever said.

I give up. I refuse to respond to any more of your posts on this topic.

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Warbler said:

Possessed said:

How about everybody should wear a top when in public? Can we just agree on that and let it go?

Do you wear a top when you go swimming?

The only place I ever swim is at the pool on the private property of a member of my immediate family, and no, I don’t wear a top. And this’ll make you hate me again, but I don’t even wear a bottom in that swimming pool!

The Person in Question

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yhwx said:

Warbler said:

TV’s Frink said:

With that said, I don’t think women everywhere should suddenly go topless.

sexist! How dare you suggest we should continue this oppression of women!

You’re making absolutely no sense now.

Now?

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TV’s Frink said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

You know, I’m starting to think this thread was a better idea than y’all said it was.

Because it somehow helped?

Not that I can see.

It could have helped.

By getting more diverse people to join the forum?

The thread could have diagnosed the problems that are getting more diverse people to not join the forum, and therefore, put the structures in place that would help more of them join the forum.

And as I said, discussions about diversity are useful. It raises awareness about the issue, which is important.

Its a Star Wars forum. Its not going to attract women.

I’m not even going to read any farther to see if anyone else responded yet.

What the fuck, man?

I know right? What about the women that are on the forum? Also, I’m pretty sure there’re a lot of women on the Force dot net.

The Person in Question

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Warbler said:

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

There is a particular male-centered-ness to Warbler’s and chyron’s arguments. Why does the male body have to be the standard that we measure women against?

It’s not unreasonable.

No its ridiculous. I am not using the male body as the standard that we measure women against. There is nothing male-centered about my argument.

You are saying that the female body is different than the male body. You are comparing it to the male body. Your argument is male-centered.

Many women also agree that the female breasts should be covered.

That’s not the point.

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Warbler said:

Star Wars just doesn’t attract women?

No offense but do you know any women? This is extremely ignorant.

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yhwx said:

Warbler said:

TV’s Frink said:

“A woman’s body isn’t treated as anymore obscene than a man’s.”
“Tell that to the top half of a woman’s body.”

How is this a confusing or controversial response? Is it wrong? Men can walk around without a shirt, women can’t.

female breasts = private part private parts need to be covered up.

But why? You refuse to answer that question.

Why does the question need to be answered? American culture equates female breasts as being private parts.

Demanding the answer to “Why?” is as good as asking “Why not?”

TV’s Frink said:

chyron just put a big Ric pic in your sig and be done with it.

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yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

You know, I’m starting to think this thread was a better idea than y’all said it was.

Because it somehow helped?

Not that I can see.

It could have helped.

By getting more diverse people to join the forum?

The thread could have diagnosed the problems that are getting more diverse people to not join the forum, and therefore, put the structures in place that would help more of them join the forum.

And as I said, discussions about diversity are useful. It raises awareness about the issue, which is important.

Its a Star Wars forum. Its not going to attract women.

That’s a problem.

Its a problem a that this place is a Star Wars forum or that Star Wars just doesn’t attract women?

The latter.

No offense but do you actually know any women? This is extremely ignorant.