moviefreakedmind said:

TV’s Frink said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

You know, I’m starting to think this thread was a better idea than y’all said it was.

Because it somehow helped?

Not that I can see.

It could have helped.

By getting more diverse people to join the forum?

The thread could have diagnosed the problems that are getting more diverse people to not join the forum, and therefore, put the structures in place that would help more of them join the forum.

And as I said, discussions about diversity are useful. It raises awareness about the issue, which is important.

Its a Star Wars forum. Its not going to attract women.

I’m not even going to read any farther to see if anyone else responded yet.

What the fuck, man?

I know right? What about the women that are on the forum? Also, I’m pretty sure there’re a lot of women on the Force dot net.

Every female in my house (at last count four, including the dog) loves Star Wars.

And yes, what about Mark’s Down. Or twister (before she left). Or Mala. Or Molly. Or Mielr (can’t remember her actual username, I’m sure that’s way off). Or all the others I’m forgetting.

But with some of the attitudes here (including in non-off-topic areas, see Mary Sue arguments) it’s not surprising most wouldn’t want to post.

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

TV’s Frink said:

Handman said:

Frink, you wouldn’t have any issue if your wife or daughter walked around topless?

Nowhere did I say I think women should walk around topless.

You sure seemed to be implying it. Why shouldn’t women walk around topless if men can? You should tell your female family members to do so, you don’t want to oppress them do you?

Holy shit. This is a completely illogical extension of what we’ve all been saying.

How is it a completely illogical extension?

We are simply against the double standard here; nobody here is telling women to strip topless for us.

Then you want women to able to good around topless just as men can, right?

I merely disputed Warb’s assertion that men’s and women’s bodies are treated equally.

They are treated equally, they just have different private parts.

2 = 1

Does this sound equal to you?

*rolls eyes*

moviefreakedmind said:

Warbler said:

moviefreakedmind said:

because nobody wants to see any of these people topless.

Nobody? Pretty sure some men want to see women topless.

I can’t believe that I have to point this out, but nudity outside of very specific contexts is incredibly unattractive.

fact: some men pay to see women topless.

chyron8472 said:

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

TV’s Frink said:

With that said, I don’t think women everywhere should suddenly go topless.

sexist! How dare you suggest we should continue this oppression of women!

You’re making absolutely no sense now.

That was sarcasm.

Now? 😉

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

You know, I’m starting to think this thread was a better idea than y’all said it was.

Because it somehow helped?

Not that I can see.

It could have helped.

By getting more diverse people to join the forum?

The thread could have diagnosed the problems that are getting more diverse people to not join the forum, and therefore, put the structures in place that would help more of them join the forum.

And as I said, discussions about diversity are useful. It raises awareness about the issue, which is important.

Its a Star Wars forum. Its not going to attract women.

That’s a problem.

Its a problem a that this place is a Star Wars forum or that Star Wars just doesn’t attract women?

The latter.

No offense but do you actually know any women? This is extremely ignorant.

You called me out, and you are 100% right. I am wrong right here. I think I read or interpreted that question wrong. I think it’s bad that this forum does not attract women. There are also deeper societal reasons as to why this is the case.

I am sorry for my accidental ignorance in this situation. People must always acknowledge when they are wrong. Again, sorry.

Thank you. As I edited in above, the attitudes some display here (not you, you erred and apologized, which I appreciate, though obviously I don’t speak for women) both in off-topic and outside of it, are not exactly welcoming to women.

Warbler said:

moviefreakedmind said:

Warbler said:

moviefreakedmind said:

because nobody wants to see any of these people topless.

Nobody? Pretty sure some men want to see women topless.

I can’t believe that I have to point this out, but nudity outside of very specific contexts is incredibly unattractive.

fact: some men pay to see women topless.

That’s not a specific context? Hard to get more specific than that!

can we get this back to being a politics thread?

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

DominicCobb said:

chyron8472 said:

yhwx said:

chyron8472 said:

Citing equality doesn’t really fit, because they are not equal. Saying a woman should be paid as much as a man because a woman’s ability or intelligence is equal is not the same thing as saying women’s bodies, which are not identical to men’s, should be treated identically. Having a woman cover her breasts does not lower her social standing or make her to be inferior to a man.

Let’s turn the tables. Is the argument that a certain part of a man’s body should be censored because it’s different from that part on a woman a valid argument to you?

I don’t think it is censored because it different. I think there are reasons other than simply it being different as to why it is censored, and those reasons are potentially sound.

Women’s breasts aren’t just different-and-that’s-it. Men have sexual responses to them. Women have clothing that accentuates them. Women and men both treat women’s physical bodies differently than women and men both treat men’s bodies. Women have different attractions to men than men do to women, and so arguing that men’s bodies and women’s bodies should be treated equally (or identically) “because” isn’t reason enough to not treat the differently.

You don’t think women have sexual responses to men’s exposed chests?

are now going to try to tell me that women’s sexual responses to men’s exposed chests = men’s sexual responses to women’s exposed chests?

And now you’re suddenly the expert on women’s sexual response to men’s bodies.

I am not an expert but I will bet my life savings that

women’s sexual responses to men’s exposed chests ≠ men’s sexual responses to women’s exposed chests?

A little bit, but there are different standards of beauty around the world. In other cultures, female breasts aren’t considered nearly as erotic as they are in the Western world. The ideal weight for a man and a woman also changes around the world. It’s not just biology. It’s culture too.

but it is partly biology.

chyron8472 said:

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

There is a particular male-centered-ness to Warbler’s and chyron’s arguments. Why does the male body have to be the standard that we measure women against?

It’s not unreasonable.

No its ridiculous. I am not using the male body as the standard that we measure women against. There is nothing male-centered about my argument.

You are saying that the female body is different than the male body. You are comparing it to the male body. Your argument is male-centered.

He is male. He is speaking from a male’s point of view. Of course he is going to center his argument on and derive opinion from his personal life experience. Calling him out on it serves no purpose them to presume the male opinion on a somewhat female issue inherently has less merit.

Be that as it may be, Warb just said his argument is not male-centered, so which is it?

dahmage said:

can we get this back to being a politics thread?

dahmage said:

can we get this back to being a politics thread?

dahmage said:

can we get this back to being a politics thread?

HERE YOU GO!

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

TV’s Frink said:

With that said, I don’t think women everywhere should suddenly go topless.

sexist! How dare you suggest we should continue this oppression of women!

You’re making absolutely no sense now.

I don’t? But I thought it was sexist and oppressive to make women cover up their breasts?

TV’s Frink said:

dahmage said:

can we get this back to being a politics thread?

HERE YOU GO!

THANK YOU

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

Warbler said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

TV’s Frink said:

yhwx said:

You know, I’m starting to think this thread was a better idea than y’all said it was.

Because it somehow helped?

Not that I can see.

It could have helped.

By getting more diverse people to join the forum?

The thread could have diagnosed the problems that are getting more diverse people to not join the forum, and therefore, put the structures in place that would help more of them join the forum.

And as I said, discussions about diversity are useful. It raises awareness about the issue, which is important.

Its a Star Wars forum. Its not going to attract women.

That’s a problem.

Its a problem a that this place is a Star Wars forum or that Star Wars just doesn’t attract women?

The latter.

That “problem” goes beyond the scope of just this forum. It not going to change anytime soon. Men and women just like to watch different kinds of movies/tv shows.

yhwx said:

dahmage said:

dahmage said:

can we get this back to being a politics thread?

This can cover social issues too, and it’s very privileged for you to take the position you are taking now.

sorry warb, but i am stealing your bit

*sigh*