Politics 2: Electric Boogaloo — Page 513

chyron8472 said:

But again, I criticize the insincerity; the disingenuousness. That they likely use a call to prayer to gain popularity with people of faith than actually being genuine in their own faith.

Then criticize them for being disingenuous, not the prayer itself.

My dad always said he doesn’t like people putting a cross or an ichthus on their business cards or marketing materials, because it is not clear that they aren’t just using it disingenuously to drum up sales.

But what the ones that aren’t doing it to drum up sales?

chyron8472 said:

Warbler said:

TM2YC said:

There is nothing wrong with our leaders playing the violin… as long they are also providing adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation.

True, but if they don’t provide adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation, criticize them for that, not playing the violin.

Why not both? If they don’t actually play the violin but are instead pretending to make the crowd like them better?

Then critize them for their reason for playing the violin.

i wish i had popcorn

chyron8472 said:

Warbler said:

chyron8472 said:

But again, I criticize the insincerity; the disingenuousness. That they likely use a call to prayer to gain popularity with people of faith than actually being genuine in their own faith.

Then criticize them for being disingenuous, not the prayer itself.

My dad always said he doesn’t like people putting a cross or an ichthus on their business cards or marketing materials, because it is not clear that they aren’t just using it disingenuously to drum up sales.

But what the ones that aren’t doing it to drum up sales?

We don’t know which is which. That is the problem.

So you assume disingenuiosness. Guily until proven innocent. That seems like problem too.

Let us do the praying, while they do the legislating. They shouldn’t call us to pray, because it is not clear they mean it.

They can do both. I somehow don’t think that because it is not clear, means they shouldn’t ask for prayer.

Your suspicions of my real motivations for asking for prayer, won’t stop me from asking people to pray.

Warbler said:

TM2YC said:

There is nothing wrong with our leaders playing the violin… as long they are also providing adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation.

True, but if they don’t provide adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation, criticize them for that, not playing the violin.

But if the city is burning and all they’re doing is playing…

chyron8472 said:

We should call ourselves to pray. And we should pray for them. They shouldn’t call for us to pray when one thing we obviously pray for is for them to do something when they insist on doing nothing but to call for us to pray.

So they automatically not allowed to pray or ask for prayer because they are politicians?

Again, criticize them for doing nothing then.

chyron8472 said:

“When you pray, don’t be like the hypocrites who love to pray publicly on street corners and in the synagogues where everyone can see them. I tell you the truth, that is all the reward they will ever get. But when you pray, go away by yourself, shut the door behind you, and pray to your Father in private. Then your Father, who sees everything, will reward you.”

–Matthew 6:5-6

If they pray, they should do so privately. They should not stand on the street corners and use prayer to tout themselves.

I don’t think that means we should’t ask people to pray. Yes, criticize for not meaning it, don’t criticize praying or the asking for prayer itself.

DominicCobb said:

Warbler said:

TM2YC said:

There is nothing wrong with our leaders playing the violin… as long they are also providing adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation.

True, but if they don’t provide adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation, criticize them for that, not playing the violin.

But if the city is burning and all they’re doing is playing…

Criticize them for not doing anything about the fact that the city is burning. What else they are doing or is irrelevant to that point.

chyron8472 said:

I criticize them for using God to gain votes!!

Dang it, Warbler.

"When you pray, don’t be like the hypocrites who love to pray publicly on street corners and in the synagogues where everyone can see them. I tell you the truth, that is all the reward they will ever get. But when you pray, go away by yourself, shut the door behind you, and pray to your Father in private. Then your Father, who sees everything, will reward you.

“When you pray, don’t babble on and on as the Gentiles do. They think their prayers are answered merely by repeating their words again and again. Don’t be like them, for your Father knows exactly what you need even before you ask him!

[…]

“And when you fast, don’t make it obvious, as the hypocrites do, for they try to look miserable and disheveled so people will admire them for their fasting. I tell you the truth, that is the only reward they will ever get. But when you fast, comb your hair and wash your face. Then no one will notice that you are fasting, except your Father, who knows what you do in private. And your Father, who sees everything, will reward you."

—Matthew 6:5-8,16-18

I criticize them for using prayer to glorify themselves.

Ok, but seems like some are criticizing prayer and the asking for prayer itself.

chyron8472 said:

They do not care about fixing the problems with gun violence. They just want to use tragedy to look sympathetic and sway minds to thinking them worthy of staying in office.

A valid thing to criticize them for.

chyron8472 said:

Warbler said:

DominicCobb said:

Warbler said:

TM2YC said:

There is nothing wrong with our leaders playing the violin… as long they are also providing adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation.

True, but if they don’t provide adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation, criticize them for that, not playing the violin.

But if the city is burning and all they’re doing is playing…

Criticize them for not doing anything about the fact that the city is burning. What else they are doing or is irrelevant to that point.

It is not irrelevant. Faith is never irrelevant.

That misses my point. I wasn’t saying faith itself was irrelevant

But they aren’t using it for God’s glory, they’re using it for their own. And that is extremely relevant.

And a valid thing to criticize them for.

They. do. not. care. They don’t do anything more than what is required to make them look good, and calling for prayer makes them look good.

I agree. Target your criticism towards their insincerity, not prayer or the asking for it.

Warbler said:

DominicCobb said:

Warbler said:

TM2YC said:

There is nothing wrong with our leaders playing the violin… as long they are also providing adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation.

True, but if they don’t provide adequate fire-fighting services and fire-safety legislation, criticize them for that, not playing the violin.

But if the city is burning and all they’re doing is playing…

Criticize them for not doing anything about the fact that the city is burning. What else they are doing or is irrelevant to that point.

You’re contorting yourself here to make your point.

Obviously the mere act of playing the fiddle is not what’s reprehensible, it’s that they’re doing it instead of something useful. The thing is, if you were to criticize them, you’d be going out of your way to not say “the city is burning and yet you’re just here playing the fiddle.” But again, just because you say that doesn’t mean that you have a problem with them playing the fiddle by itself. That fact is easily understood.

dahmage said:

i wish i had popcorn

Sending dahmaged thoughts and popcorns.

Yikes.

chyron8472 said:

Warbler said:

chyron8472 said:

They do not care about fixing the problems with gun violence. They just want to use tragedy to look sympathetic and sway minds to thinking them worthy of staying in office.

A valid thing to criticize them for.

Yes, and their calling for prayer is part of that. It’s not prayer itself that’s the issue.

Some people don’t word their complaints carefully enough to make that clear.

It’s who is calling for it and that it’s called for publicly for all to witness.

So the same with moments of silence.

Well I still think walking out on one is wrong.