I don't think he waited for CGI.
I think CGI developed just when he needed a bit more cash.
From all accounts Lucas had no desire to make more Star Wars movies some way into the production of ROTJ.
He wanted to wrap it up and deal with his personal problems.
I think the nineties revival of interest in Star Wars caught him as much by surprise as the initial success of the seventies and he wanted the cash.
Zero said:
Star Wars is a tribute to the cheesy sci-fi serials.
Not so much a tribute, as taking some of the good core ideas (capes and swords with ray-guns), but executing them well.
The prequels are actually far, far closer in tone to the old serials that the OT was.
“It is only through interaction, through decision and choice, through confrontation, physical or mental, that the Force can grow within you.”
-Kreia, Jedi Master and Sith Lord
theprequelsrule said:
Zero said:
Star Wars is a tribute to the cheesy sci-fi serials.Not so much a tribute, as taking some of the good core ideas (capes and swords with ray-guns), but executing them well.
The prequels are actually far, far closer in tone to the old serials that the OT was.
xhonzi said:theprequelsrule said:
xhonzi said:
Tone.
Can you elaborate?
Gosh, I thought I wouldn't have to.
Um... the tone sucks?
I stand vindicated!
IT'S MY TRILOGY, AND I WANT IT NOW!
"[George Lucas] rebooted the franchise in 1997 without telling anyone." -skyjedi2005
"Yeah, well, George says a lot of things..." a young 1997 xhonzi on RASSM
"They're my movies." -George Lucas. 19 people won oscars for their work on Star Wars (1977) and George Lucas wasn't one of them.
Bingowings said:
I don't think he waited for CGI.
I think CGI developed just when he needed a bit more cash.
I remember seeing an interview with him in the bonus material on some DVD from sometime in the last 10 years. I'm paraphrasing but he said that he saw the development of CGI technology and where it was going. After Jurassic Park the moment seemed to have arrived and he began work on the prequels. Of course, he could have been talking out of both sides of his mouth. Your take on it could very well be closer to the truth.
In any case, I still maintain my opinion that he should have done the prequels in the 1980s.
But if I were in George's shoes, I wouldn't have made the prequels at all. Maybe that's the most apt fatal flaw criticism. This whole prequel stuff started when he re-titled Star Wars as A New Hope. Calling that film "A New Hope" still feels weird in my mouth. Regular folks (non-fans) who are my age or older still call it "Star Wars". Oh, sure, I was all psyched up about there supposedly being nine episodes in all. But in hindsight, I would have just left it as a trilogy and gone on to make a beach party sequel to THX 1138. Or something.
Zero said:
But if I were in George's shoes, I wouldn't have made the prequels at all. Maybe that's the most apt fatal flaw criticism. This whole prequel stuff started when he re-titled Star Wars as A New Hope. Calling that film "A New Hope" still feels weird in my mouth. Regular folks (non-fans) who are my age or older still call it "Star Wars". Oh, sure, I was all psyched up about there supposedly being nine episodes in all. But in hindsight, I would have just left it as a trilogy and gone on to make a beach party sequel to THX 1138. Or something.
Yes. It really was amazing that we got three very good to great films (yeah, yeah, some people don't like Jedi).
I kind of wish George had stuck with his original 12 film plan following The Adventures of Luke Skywalker - which were envisioned more as a kind of James Bond series in space, rather than proper sequels/prequels. Sure, we would never have gotten ESB, but then ESB is why we are in this mess in the first place...
“It is only through interaction, through decision and choice, through confrontation, physical or mental, that the Force can grow within you.”
-Kreia, Jedi Master and Sith Lord
Zero said:
a beach party sequel to THX 1138.
Just wanted to point out that this is a fantastic idea.
IMHO, the prequels should have been set THOUSANDS of years before the OT. Completely original story and characters in the same universe as the OT. If any of you have played Knights of the Old Republic, you know what I'm talking about. This would avoid all problems with continuity and visual anachronisms.
In TPM, Darth Maul says, "At last we will have our revenge [on the Jedi]". What is he talking about? No one knows - this is a complete nonsense line within the context of the films. The prequels should have been about THAT.
To the extent that the prequels didn't meet the expectations of many dedicated fans, I think GL was trying to wear too many hats.
He was trying to serve as the next Rodenberry/Asimov/Stan Lee.
He was trying to serve as the driving force in FX developement.
He was trying to serve as the one to pick up the Walt Disney mantel.
He has been astoundingly successful in each of those fields individually.
Taken together, inconsistencies were created.
timdiggerm said:
Zero said:
a beach party sequel to THX 1138.
Just wanted to point out that this is a fantastic idea.
Seconded.
Keep Circulating the Tapes.
END OF LINE
(It hasn’t happened yet)
My main problem with the Prequels aside from all the obvious and mostly fixable flaws is that there really is nothing natural/organic like the OT. The technology actually waters them down. The "lack" of technology makes the OT shine.....it's part of the magic that still draws me when I pop in my Laserdiscs.
The Phantom Menace is the only one of the prequels that resembles the OT in that respect....everything else is a digital nightmare to me.
I watched from star wars to Jedi again, and i was like how can this man who made these wonderful films, be the same man who made the prequel trilogy?
George had to have changed dramatically for the drop in quality between the trilogies.
“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.
While I don't consider it to be a fatal flaw, I think the real problem started with Empire Strikes Back. Prior to the development of Empire Strikes Back, Star Wars was looking to be a much more light hearted series. I get the feeling it would have been a lot more like Indiana Jones were each movie was an all new adventure for the Star Warriors. GL even talked about having other filmmakers come in an take a stab at some continuing adventures with his characters. I think it would have played out like an ongoing comic book with each movie being a new story arc.
Instead, Empire comes along and makes Darth Vader Luke's father and establishes that Star Wars was episode 4, there are now 3 prequels about Anakin, and at least one more sequel since Empire ended on a cliffhanger. Empire may have been great, but it marked the beginning of the interconnected 6 part melodrama that we ended up with instead of the continuing adventures of Luke Skywalker and the Star Warriors that we could have gotten. It could have been better, but then again, it could have been worse.
While I don't think it's fair to compare Empire to the prequels, as far as I'm concerned, it was the same line of thought that produced both.
"George, we hate you for making more Star Wars movies. Please make more Star Wars movies."
-The Internet
timdiggerm said:
Zero said:
a beach party sequel to THX 1138.
Just wanted to point out that this is a fantastic idea.
Considering the final shot in the movie was filmed near a beach, that's not such a crazy idea. ;)
Where were you in '77?
Beyond Lucas horrible scripts and directing, David Tatterstall's boring ho hum cinematography, i think the absolute worst actually is Ben Burtt editing and too much sound effects and not enough John Williams.
Burtt instead of being a collaborator as in the original trilogy is largely solely responsible for the final mixes.
“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.
skyjedi2005 said:
Beyond Lucas horrible scripts and directing, David Tatterstall's boring ho hum cinematography, i think the absolute worst actually is Ben Burtt editing and too much sound effects and not enough John Williams.
Burtt instead of being a collaborator as in the original trilogy is largely solely responsible for the final mixes.
I actually enjoyed the penetrant soundwork everywhere except maybe the arena scene.
Those "sound-only" sequences were probably among the most enjoyable aspects of the prequels.
Darth Bizarro said:
While I don't think it's fair to compare Empire to the prequels, as far as I'm concerned, it was the same line of thought that produced both.
Flawed thinking, imo.
There would've been nothing wrong with the prequels, had they been as good as ESB.
Blaming ESB for the whackjob they did with the prequels, is almost bordering on insane troll logic.
Aside from that, you said it yourself - it was conceived as (and modeled after) serials and comics, and Flash Gordon had on-going storylines throughout its "episodes" as well.
So what would've stopped them from going back and filming the story arc that was ALREADY MENTIONED IN THE FIRST FILM? ANH already introduced the backstory element, Empire only added the "father" part to it.
We can all wonder what would happen if they made the sequels in the same tone with stand-alone plots, and compare it to other film series such as Rush Hour or Fantomas (just to name a few), and if maybe it could've been better, but naming the prequels that followed 20 years after as an argument... is simply ludicrous.
twooffour said:
Darth Bizarro said:
While I don't think it's fair to compare Empire to the prequels, as far as I'm concerned, it was the same line of thought that produced both.
Flawed thinking, imo.
There would've been nothing wrong with the prequels, had they been as good as ESB.
Blaming ESB for the whackjob they did with the prequels, is almost bordering on insane troll logic.
Aside from that, you said it yourself - it was conceived as (and modeled after) serials and comics, and Flash Gordon had on-going storylines throughout its "episodes" as well.
So what would've stopped them from going back and filming the story arc that was ALREADY MENTIONED IN THE FIRST FILM? ANH already introduced the backstory element, Empire only added the "father" part to it.
We can all wonder what would happen if they made the sequels in the same tone with stand-alone plots, and compare it to other film series such as Rush Hour or Fantomas (just to name a few), and if maybe it could've been better, but naming the prequels that followed 20 years after as an argument... is simply ludicrous.
I will not be replying to any more of your posts. Good day sir.
"George, we hate you for making more Star Wars movies. Please make more Star Wars movies."
-The Internet
Ah, I'd already forgotten I've ever written that post, so thanks for reminding me anyway, and thanks for announcing your own insignifance with such clarity, just to make sure I get it!
Tool.
skyjedi2005 said:
Beyond Lucas horrible scripts and directing, David Tatterstall's boring ho hum cinematography, i think the absolute worst actually is Ben Burtt editing and too much sound effects and not enough John Williams.
Burtt instead of being a collaborator as in the original trilogy is largely solely responsible for the final mixes.
Ben Burtt has definitely followed his master to the darkside. "I am genius, therefore my work is paramount!"
“It is only through interaction, through decision and choice, through confrontation, physical or mental, that the Force can grow within you.”
-Kreia, Jedi Master and Sith Lord
Ben Burtt looked like Lucas's timid slave in the prequel documentaries. Just another yes man stroking George's ego.
I used to think the Burtt was a genius coming up with the Star Wars sounds in my youth.
Star Wars 1977-1983
Star Trek 1966-1991
LeoneNut said:
Ben Burtt looked like Lucas's timid slave in the prequel documentaries. Just another yes man stroking George's ego.
I used to think the Burtt was a genius coming up with the Star Wars sounds in my youth.
He is a genius when kept to what he is good at sound design, not editing or anything else.
His work on Wall E and Star Trek were pretty good. I guess he was just giving George what he wanted.
I have a feeling on some parts George just told him to go nuts, like with the roger roger robots in menace, or the asteroid explosion in clones.
“Always loved Vader’s wordless self sacrifice. Another shitty, clueless, revision like Greedo and young Anakin’s ghost. What a fucking shame.” -Simon Pegg.
skyjedi2005 said:
David Tatterstall's boring ho hum cinematography
I kinda got the photography bug this summer and barely know what an f stop is, so im definitely a rookie but it is something i look for.
its funny for a supposed 'visual filmmaker', you don't hear or read to much about david tattersalls contributions. I know he was part of the young indiana jones crew. The only anecdotes i can think of was how they setup the lights in that italian castle and the lighting of vader's surgery.
I can think of several instances where shots are not as interesting as erik tiemans and ryan church's paintings. I guess AOTC was pretty photogenic, but so much of ROTS alternated between flat or garish. everything captured on utapau sucks! :(
99% of the time when you hear about the camerawork its regarding the new digital cameras, thats it. its almost as if the DP was made irrelevant. Maybe with all that green screen, it is :(
I was concerned that 'digital cinema' was going to make cinematography obsolete because of inconvenience. Kinda how modern day houses don't have the charm of vintage houses. but almost 10 years later, there are plenty of films shot in digital that look pretty good. Michael Mann's collateral, for example. So did Superman Returns.
I know lucas had issues with gilbert taylor on ANH and i heard rumors that ROTJ had another DP that was fired (and that film i always thought looked surprisingly plain)
ESB, OTOH, must have had a great DP. dagobah was on a soundstage, but that is one cool looking swamp. He's worked on some David cronenberg movies that are cool and have an interesting look to them.
Edited my original post
“It is only through interaction, through decision and choice, through confrontation, physical or mental, that the Force can grow within you.”
-Kreia, Jedi Master and Sith Lord
theprequelsrule said:
Edited my original post
I will not read it unless I can get the unaltered original post
Since they're like poetry, what with the rhyming and all, I find that I only need to watch three out of the six films.
Monolithium said:
theprequelsrule said:
Edited my original post.
I will read it when I can get the unedited original post.
That only applies to the OT.
Star Wars Episode XXX: Erica Strikes Back
If you want Nice, go to France