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Post #1161825

Author
DrDre
Parent topic
The Last Jedi: Official Review and Opinions Thread ** SPOILERS **
Link to post in topic
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1161825/action/topic#1161825
Date created
23-Jan-2018, 12:10 PM

yotsuya said:

DrDre said:

yhwx said:

It’s amazing how people have selective amnesia. Yes, Luke did throw away his saber in ROTJ, but a few seconds before, he was about to kill Vader. And a few minutes before that, he’s prepared to “strike down” the Emperor, only to have his faithful apprentice intercept the attack.

I would call that a character arc. These things didn’t happen in a random order. Luke get’s goaded into using force, first by Palps, then by Vader to the point of almost killing Vader. Luke realizes he’s about to follow in his father footsteps, and composes himself, tossing away his lightsaber. He’s learned a valuable lesson, and passed the test. A test he then again fails in TLJ.

How did he fail that same test? Aren’t his actions just consistent with how he was portrayed in ROTJ? A person doesn’t stop making mistakes just because they make the right decision one time. As you pointed out, the Emperor goaded Luke into striking. Vader goaded Luke into striking. He seems to like striking and be easily goaded and then later comes to his senses. How then is going to Ben’s hut to confront him and freaking out about how far he has fallen and igniting his light saber out of character. It seems totally in character by the very example you have provided. That is his MO. React on instinct and then let his wisdom rein him in. You have just proven with your own examples that Luke’s actions in Ben’s hut are 100% consistent with ROTJ Luke.

I don’t agree. The idea of a character arc is, that people make a journey, usually learning from their mistakes, such that they don’t make that mistake again. In TESB Luke drew his weapon first when confronted with Vader, itching for a fight. In ROTJ Luke had to be goaded into a fight, and he resisted the Emperor for a long time, despite the real threat and suffering he faced. Luke learned from his experience in TESB, as he learned from his experience in ROTJ to finally become a Jedi. So, after ROTJ Luke should have grown beyond such mistakes in my view. The situation with the possible future of Ben Solo pales in comparison to Luke’s previous real experiences from my point of view, and so he should have been able to control himself. Let’s not forget Luke has had at least two decades to learn from his experiences before his fallout with young Ben, and to grow as a Jedi Master. Yet, TLJ seems to suggest the opposite happened. Luke regressed, and turned out to have become a far worse Jedi than Obi-Wan or Yoda, despite growing beyond their dogma in ROTJ.

And Luke runs off (as Ben and Yoda did, and as he himself did in TESB and ROTJ) to find answers at the first Jedi Temple.

There’s nothing in TLJ to suggest Luke went looking for answers. He said he came there to die. The situation cannot be compared to Obi-Wan and Yoda, who bided their time until there was a real hope of defeating the Empire. When Leia asked Obi-Wan for help in their most desperate hour, he gave it to them. Luke just gave up, and refused to help.

His failure was not just in igniting his lightsaber, it was in failing to see the darkness in his nephew. I was failing Leia. For a man who grew up an orphan, found his father and sister, redeemed his father (and hopefully has conversed with his force ghost though that is pure conjection) and then fails his sister in the one thing she needed his help with… can you just imagine the level of anguish that would cause? He failed both of his living blood relatives. Not to mention his best friend.

He did not fail to see the darkness, he simply misjudged how far Ben had already fallen. How does he go about fixing his error of judgement? He becomes anti-Jedi, and runs away. The end result: his best friend is dead, and his sister is in a coma. That’s quite a character change for it to be condensed to a sixty second flashback.

It is not so much that I don’t respect your right to your opinion, it is that I am confused how you got there. Everything about the Luke from the OT that I grew up with points to this being a logical offshoot and a story that makes sense in setting up the ST.

Yeah, and everything I grew up with points in the opposite direction. We just don’t agree, and have a different interpretation of a character, which is perfectly fine. You will continue to enjoy the ST, while for me the saga ends with a final victory in ROTJ while old Sebastian Shaw looks proudly at his son, who will rebuild the Jedi order in a new era of peace and justice.