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Post #1159741

Author
chyron8472
Parent topic
The Last Jedi: Official Review and Opinions Thread ** SPOILERS **
Link to post in topic
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1159741/action/topic#1159741
Date created
18-Jan-2018, 2:23 PM

Collipso said:

chyron8472 said:

Shopping Maul said:

chyron8472 said:

Shopping Maul said:

adywan said:

Valheru_84 said:

All this Yoda calling lighting justification talk sounds to me like mental gymnastics 101. Yoda somehow via the force either creating, influencing, directing, etc. the lightning in TLJ just doesn’t sit right with me whatever the reasoning. Pre-ST force ghosts could not affect the physical world. Suddenly in the ST they can directly influence the force back in the real world.

Sorry but I don’t buy it anymore than I bought the ugly Yoda puppet. I also didn’t buy “crazy yoda” as he wasn’t crazy or unhinged in the OT, just a little eccentric and put on a crazy act to either test Luke in TESB or make himself seem harmless while checking out who this stranger was that just crash landed in his backyard.

Val

Yoda was joking around even when he was dying in ROTJ. He always had a jovial side. Something the PT completely got rid of with grumpy frowning Yoda. TLJ Yoda was the same Yoda we see in the OT.

And OT Force ghosts could interact physically with the real world, so why can’t they also use the force? Or is it just because it’s been introduced in the ST that’s the problem?

I don’t recall any physical interaction in the OT (apart from Obi Wan’s ludicrous ‘sitting on log’ scene which doesn’t really count IMO). The issue is the fact that ghost-Obi Wan made it plain he could not assist Luke in fighting Vader. This means either a) force-ghosts can’t interact or b) force-ghosts are jerks.

Maybe, as a Jedi, Ben Kenobi feels it is appropriate to let Luke face his own battles rather than directly interfering. To do so would disrupt Luke’s journey toward becoming a Jedi because it could turn Luke into a noob by relying on Ben to solve Luke’s problems.

That is, Ben could interfere, but chooses not to because it is inappropriate in order for Luke to forge his own path correctly. When Ben says “I can not interfere”, he’s referring to a moral code rather than a physical limitation.

I think there’s a nice simplicity to the idea of force-ghosts as personal guides only. Giving them discretionary physicality muddies the waters somewhat (as evidenced by this thread).

because neither Obi-Wan nor Yoda use them.

That would naturally lead one to believe that they can’t do anything, don’t you think?

Can’t tell if serious or sarcastic.

 
One might even make a comparison between Star Wars’ force-ghosts and Stargate SG-1’s ascended Ancients. The Ancients are capable of extraordinary power over the “lower planes”—but they don’t use them, and they don’t let other ascended use them, because they feel to do so disrupts the natural evolution of said lower planes and it opens the door to ascended beings being straight up worshipped.

It’s quite possible that, as a being of The Force itself, one is not only given physical power but also knowledge and understanding of the nature of the universe itself, and of time and destiny. So maybe, as force-ghosts, they understand that there is more to the universe than who currently controls that particular galaxy’s government. A bigger picture, if you will, and so they leave beings of the physical plane to work it out for themselves.

And you have no way of knowing that the force-ghosts couldn’t already foresee Vader making the decision he did before he made it, or knowing that Luke would not ultimately be killed. They have a different perspective, so there’s no way to be certain whether or not they didn’t intervene in that moment of Luke being electrocuted because they knew they didn’t need to.