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Post #1152366

Author
NFBisms
Parent topic
The Last Jedi: Official Review and Opinions Thread ** SPOILERS **
Link to post in topic
https://originaltrilogy.com/post/id/1152366/action/topic#1152366
Date created
2-Jan-2018, 12:15 AM

DrDre said:

NFBisms said:

I don’t even think you have to assume Luke changed at all within the 30+ years, tbh.

The Luke I know coming out of ROTJ would absolutely hold himself accountable for failing himself and his ideals in the way he did that night. He wouldn’t just brush off messing up like that with Ben and continue pretending to be so self-righteous, when he feels that he isn’t. I can understand his reaction to keep himself away from the galaxy because of his arc in 4-6 teaching him that action doesn’t always mean heroism.

In his mind, his presence and the spread of the teachings that turned Vader and Kylo, endangered the galaxy and only doomed it to more of the same darkness. A cycle that would only continue repeating itself.

You see this kind of thinking with “I shouldn’t have come I’m jeopardizing the mission” when he senses Vader is on Endor with them. And you see an extension of it when he assures Leia that she is the next hope if he doesn’t make it back from the Death Star II. If he feels he can only make something worse, he feels it best to stay away, and he knows that even when he’s gone, there is still light in the galaxy - heroes that will fight for good.

“To say that because the Jedi die the light dies, is vanity.”

I’m not saying he was right to stay away. The whole idea is that he’s wrong, and that he can still be a hero. But it fits with the character for me. I don’t think he changed drastically in those 30 years. A huge thing just put him in a drastically different place.

Yes, but to me this ignores the obviously better solution of him trying to stop Snoke and Kylo, and then retire. If he succeeds, he will have saved the galaxy, and then no more Jedi. If he fails, he dies, no more Jedi. Why choose for certain failure, if there’s a chance of success? Success doesn’t preclude him from ending the Jedi. How can he make things worse, than by leaving an evil Force user in charge, and allow him to train as many evil Force users, as he sees fit? Snoke didn’t need Luke. He just wanted him dead to prevent the rise of the new Jedi. The worst thing Luke could do, is to oblige, and go to some island to die. Luke’s decision just doesn’t make sense.

So is this about being true to Luke or making Luke do more heroic things?

Whatever the case, I think what you said is fair criticism of TLJ and TFA for not expanding on what really got us here. Character and theme taking precedence over plot, leaving us with very little context.

But Snoke only just got control of most of the galaxy in TFA/TLJ. The First Order hadn’t really done anything until they revealed themselves and pretty swiftly took control of the galaxy with Starkiller Base. Luke cut himself off from the force before anything even happened. Remember, he’s already missing at the start of all of this.

He wasn’t leaving Snoke in charge at the time, he was just taking himself out of the equation and all future ones. (Presuming Leia and/or the light of the galaxy would be enough to replace the Jedi). The extent of the First Order’s power and knowledge of Starkiller Base wasn’t even a thing. Even Ben and his friends probably weren’t officially the “Knights of Ren” yet.

So there’s a reason why Snoke wants to find Luke. Sure, once he finds out Luke seemingly just wants the Jedi to end, it’s about snuffing out hope, but before that, it’s obvious it’s because Luke represents a real threat. Luke coming back after what they’ve done (in my mind) was inevitable, because what they did is too big for someone like Luke to ignore. And try as he might, but Luke didn’t sneak onto the Falcon after learning of the state of the galaxy because he wanted to continue ignoring his friends.

edit: im glad this where this discussion ended i really didnt want to keep talking about it. (/s)