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what is everyones musical influence and any musicans here
what is everyones musical influence and any musicans here :: 1 < 2 > 3
hairy_hen
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Reginald ScumMy interest in most forms of popular music is minimal, and I get impatient at the way its ubiquity causes other genres to be ignored and passed over, but you won't find me trashing other people's interests. Let's not descend into douche-baggery here, folks. ;)
I do rather enjoy older heavy metal--Metallica's first four albums in particular are mind-blowingly awesome and amazingly intricate. Iron Maiden is another group I find very interesting; and Cliff Burton and Steve Harris respectively were/are truly superb bass players. Unrelated to metal, I love Weird Al for his humour and verbal dexterity.
Mostly, though, I find myself listening to much older styles. Most people lump it all under the label 'classical' music, but that name specifically refers to only a small portion of it, from around 1740-1810 or so. Generally speaking a lot of my favourite works are from the earlier Baroque period, by composers such as J. S. Bach and Antonio Vivaldi and their contemporaries, though I'm fond of many other composers from different times as well. I am usually drawn to recordings made using period instruments, either authentic or recreations, with the musicians using older playing techniques. The sound of the original instruments and tuning is quite different from their modern counterparts, and in many ways purer and more natural, if somewhat less 'sweet' sounding.
Though I wouldn't really consider myself any kind of expert, I have studied music theory in some depth, and accordingly have composed a fair amount of material myself, both for assignments and for my own benefit and enjoyment. I also learned to play the organ on a basic level to further my understanding (and to be able to play what I'd written). Eventually I sort of hit a wall in how far my intuitive grasp of the subject could actually take me, so I haven't done as much of that as I'd like lately, but it remains a strong interest, one that I renew when inspiration strikes. If I'd started younger and had more extensive ear training, I probably could have gone farther with it, but I still have fun regardless.
haljordan28
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hairy_hen I enjoy some old metal too. Wasted years by maiden, holy diver by DIO and some ozzy and wasp. I am refering to death metal and all that howling and screaming nonsense. It's pure garbage to me.
adywan
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"Untallented and clueless to the core"haljordan28 said:
I never claimed motley crue or whitesnake did and as a matter off act they are quite easy. Difficult would be country lead or rockabilly or jazz and flamengo.
It is easy to hide behind a ton of distortion and miss notes and pull off bends that do not even hit the exact note you are looking for. you can get CLOSE with rock and the blues but with country lead you have to be prescice because you are mimicking a pedal steal which is done by mechanics...also the spped at which they play leads going through clean channels and HYBRID picking on top of that..not flat picking wanking like rock guitar..is just a sheer testament to their skills.
Zack Wylde said it best "country lead players are from another planet" truth is they are not. they just put in the time to play like masters and they dont hide behind distortion. they are truly the best of the best
haljordan28 said:
Yeah I bet it's easy to criticize a music genre when you obviously know absolutely nothing about it.
People like you make me laugh.
I know guitar and I know what is difficult to play and what it not. If you think metal is then you clearly know jack shit about guitar playing.
what makes it hard? Do tell? Explain to us all what techniques are involved in death metal guitar that makes it the slightest bit challenging?
Laugh at yourself.
Now it's this type of attitude that really pisses me off. You have a really high and mighty attitude that "your type of music" is better than all the rest and you look down on other who play a different style. I played guitar/bass/keyboards/drums for just under 20 years before my health forced me to never be able to play again. I'm a metal fan but i also listen to a very wide variety of music and also enjoyed to play the same variety. But it was the ones that classed looked down on others that really got on my nerves. The amount of times that i challenged these "great" guitarists to play metal/rock and they failed miserably always put a smile on my face. Now a few of these people i knew personally and they worked as session musicians. they had worked with some very big names like Van Morrison, Joe Cocker, Eric Clapton, to name a few. Now my old band lost its guitarist a few weeks before we had an important gig so we asked one of the session musicians we knew if he could fill in because i had now turned away from the guitar for live work to concentrate more on being the vocalist. Now this guy isn't one of the ones that ever looked down on other music genres. We has seen him play many times and he was an amazing guitarist. His main styles were Country & Blues. Now we gave him a tape of the set a few weeks before the gig and he said he could learn it by just listening to it, which is the way he worked with a lot of people he played session guitar for. The night of the gig cam and you could see how much he was struggling to play our music. He freely admitted after that he didn't think before hand that this style of music would have been so hard to play and that he was wrong.
Now it was thanks to this person that, in the late 80's, i had the amazing opportunity to have an after hours acoustic jam session in a local county pub with none other than Robert Plant and Eric Clapton. It went on until the early hours in the morning and was one of the highlights of my life. I really wish someone could have recorded it as this was something to show the grandkids.
Now in every genre of music you have the good, the bad and the great. To say that musicians in a certain genre are better than the rest is just plain music snobbery and i really have no time for these types.
Now i'm not a death metal fan by a long shot but to say that it's easy just proves to me that you haven't even bothered trying to play it. Now again there are a lot of death metal bands that just play the same old stuff with the more simple riffs and solos but there are also those that have very talented guitarists that go against the norm. Now i really can't stand listening to this type of metal, but my daughter loves it. But every now and then i hear a guitarist that just catches my ear and i just can't help listening to the track.
So maybe you should laugh at yourself instead of dismissing others so quickly.
none
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And Now SOme Noise!
Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda
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legendary but little-known Jedi MasterEyeShotFirst said:
Shame, I've been searching high and low for a jazz drummer. Got too tired of all these young metal/rock drummers that play too damn loud.My last drummer had his whole set mic'd so he could be louder.
Jazz drummers have the best dynamics.
Jazz drumming requires constant use of dynamics. By contrast, rock drumming requires dynamic consistency. When I found myself in rock settings, I had no problem playing any of the patterns, but never sounded quite right because my hits weren't all at at a uniform volume. And on the flip side, it's why a better rock drummer would often sound stiff in a jazz setting.
Every music is hard to play well, and just because you're good at a more "technically advanced" style doesn't mean you can pick up one of the so-called less demanding styles and sound decent. I was fairly in demand as a sideman because I could play almost anything, but I knew when I wasn't in a jazz setting that I never sounded any more than passable. Sure, Wes Montgomery could play circles around Jimmy Page, but Led Zeppelin would suck if Wes were the lead guitarist.
And if you want to hear some really sorry-ass jazz, check out some of the YouTube clips of the great classical pianist Berezovsky playing jazz. He made some claims about jazz being easy, made a fool of himself in some clubs and then followed it up with a bunch of demeaning remarks (also on a youtube interview) about how there is nothing to it. Judging from his play, he never had a clue. By contrast, Vladimir Horowitz and Art Tatum had a sort of mutual admiration thing going, each claiming that the other was the true genius.
twooffour
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Ah, haven't heard him speak condescendingly about jazz, but yea, saw his "Mack the Knife", and it wasn't much.
A question about jazz drums, doesn't the whole practising thing they've got going on with all the rudiments and technique, include being able to actually play evenly? I know Buddy Rich's single strokes sound damn even and controlled ;)
Then again, HE did play rock charts at times...
Murry Sparkles
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haljordan28 said:
Death metal (and by extention, it's brothers thrash and black metal, not to mention its distant counsins crust punk, grindcore, and hardcore) = JUNK
and why didnt you answer my question? what techniques are involved in death metal that make it a challenge to play for a good guitar player? I am laughing at you cause you are spewing bullshit because you got offended when someone trashed your taste in music.
well guess what..just cause i think its junk or call it junk does not make it junk. thats just my opinion. Now I will tell you something that is NOT opinion but is fact. metal guitar is not difficult and not challenging at all for an accomplished or skillfull guitar player.
if metal fans want to get offended by that then so be it but the truth hurts I guess. but again if you want to try and educate me...what techniques are involved that make it hard to play? id ,love to know...cause guess what...there is NOT ANY ....NONE!
suck it up and move on. its noise and it sucks to me. no heart at all and nothing but wankers hiding behind distortion wanking power chords and running through scales with slides, hammer ons and pull offs. nothing special, nothing hard, nothing difficult.
If its not your style of music why make so much fuss over it ?. Yes there is some bollocks death metal but every style of music has its good and bad points. Some of the best guitarists around today have some form of heavy metal/rock background. Dave Mustaine , Steve Vai, Zakk Wylde, Yngwiee Malmsteen to name a very very short few!.
twooffour
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haljordan28 said:
Murry Sparkles said:
haljordan28 said:
As a musican I respect all music. Even those styles I can not stand listening to. With the exception of death metal. That is pure garbage that takes no skill what so ever to play. Always makes me laugh when I start discussing music with some kid who thinks death metal i so difficult to play
Death metal sucks...its easy..punk is decent to listen to but it is always childs play...most rock n roll in general is fairly easy to play. that is why when you go to a bar most bands play the same tired easy songs . stuff like ac/dc stone temple pilots, nirvana..etc..etc and why you never find bands that play styx,yes,ELO,genesis,REO,RUSH,etc,,etc. I am not a big fan of those guys either but their music is complex and not easy by any stretch of the imagination to play.
Does it not take some form of skill to play a guitar nevermind playing at speed?. Speed metal guitarists like Dave Mustaine could teach most pop/ rock bands how to play a guitar at any pace. You also dont have to be a kid to listen to death metal, im 36 and enjoy a good old Napalm Death or a Brutal Truth cd some days. I would also say that bands of yours such as Motley Crue and Whitesnake dont have the most challenging guitar riffs either.
I never claimed motley crue or whitesnake did and as a matter off act they are quite easy. Difficult would be country lead or rockabilly or jazz and flamengo.
It is easy to hide behind a ton of distortion and miss notes and pull off bends that do not even hit the exact note you are looking for. you can get CLOSE with rock and the blues but with country lead you have to be prescice because you are mimicking a pedal steal which is done by mechanics...also the spped at which they play leads going through clean channels and HYBRID picking on top of that..not flat picking wanking like rock guitar..is just a sheer testament to their skills.
Zack Wylde said it best "country lead players are from another planet" truth is they are not. they just put in the time to play like masters and they dont hide behind distortion. they are truly the best of the best
Two fun facts about distortion:
-It is used EVERYWHERE in metal, and in most rock.
-If someone bends to the wrong pitch, or makes a mistake, you can still hear that perfectly well. Unless one's ears aren't trained enough, in which case, too bad.
Apart from maybe the vocals (I don't know much about pitch and timbre control in growling and screaming), everything in metal is as organized as your everyday rock, and is AT LEAST as "complex and difficult".
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GOQuX7pCiPo
The guitar and drums work is stylized to produce an energetic, dark and aggressive sound - that by no means equates to NOISE. Heck, most of those riffs are either tonal or remotely.
If the harsh and aggressive sound of metal is enough for you to call it "garbage", chances are you aren't gonna like something like this, too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNsn7NjDPkM You know, it's easier to hide mistakes in stuff like that, too - at least for the more average listener.
none
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tceczVPHkTY&feature=related
The best Swedish Elvis evar. Eilert Pilarm everybody give it up.
twooffour wrote: ou aren't gonna like something like this, too: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNsn7NjDPkM You know, it's easie
moarh pleez
Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda
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legendary but little-known Jedi Mastertwooffour said:
A question about jazz drums, doesn't the whole practising thing they've got going on with all the rudiments and technique, include being able to actually play evenly?
That's an interesting question. Yeah, I certainly spent many years drilling those rudiments and how to apply them. Somewhere along the line, you learn to make them flow with the ups and downs of an improviser. The biggest problem I had playing rock was getting my bass drum to sound even. In a jazz group, the bass drum ranges from tiny nudges to explosive bombs, even in the same measure. In rock, the bass drum is so steady it can often just as well be synthesized and played on a pad. I just couldn't make my bass drum sound solid like that - if I didn't concentrate really hard, my bass drum would waver in volume. But a rock bass drum sound would be the fastest way to get yourself run out of a jazz group.
I know Buddy Rich's single strokes sound damn even and controlled ;)
Yeah, Buddy was a freak of nature. Saw him several times and still wonder how on earth anyone could achieve that much facility. It's interesting to compare him with someone like Billy Higgins. Buddy could play circles around someone like that, but ask a jazz musician who they'd rather listen to.
Quackula
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@twooffour: this was the last place I expected to ever see someone link to early Cryptopsy.
Also, what makes a good growl is really hard to pin down, it varies a lot from band to band and listener to listener. It's one of those things that's hard to define, but you know it when you hear a good one (assuming you're into that sort of thing, of course).
none
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Also, what makes a good growl is really hard to pin down
when it's done by a parrott:
Murry Sparkles
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Quackula said:
Also, what makes a good growl is really hard to pin down, it varies a lot from band to band and listener to listener. It's one of those things that's hard to define, but you know it when you hear a good one (assuming you're into that sort of thing, of course).
Some of my favourite growlers:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIXJFRVUdWo&feature=related
ChainsawAsh
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aka PancakesI'm a guitarist/keyboardist as a hobby, in that I know that I'm not good enough to be part of a band, but I'm okay with that - I do it for fun, and as a stress reliever.
As far as influences, I'm a rock guy at heart, but I'm into more experimental types of music as well as calmer, gentler music.
Specific examples of people/bands that have influenced me - this is not the same as my favorite-bands list, though all of my favorite bands are on this list; there are even some bands on here that I don't particularly like or listen to anymore, but I know they've influenced how I play (Oasis is the best example of this). I also tried to put them in the order I discovered them, but I'm sure I didn't get that quite right:
The Who
The Beatles
Led Zeppelin
Queen
The Rolling Stones
The Doors
Pink Floyd
George Harrison
Jimi Hendrix
The Kinks
Tenacious D
The Polyphonic Spree
Red Hot Chili Peppers
Oasis
Secret Machines
Beck
Bob Dylan
David Bowie
Cream
ELO
The Flaming Lips
Radiohead
They Might Be Giants
Bob Marley
moe.
Umphrey's McGee
Arcade Fire
Dirty Projectors
Bedouin Soundclash
The Black Keys
Brian Eno
Philip Glass
Fleet Foxes
Grandaddy
Medeski, Scofield, Martin & Wood (all together and separately)
Simon & Garfunkel/Paul Simon
Mumford & Sons
Quackula
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Murry Sparkles said:
Quackula said:
Also, what makes a good growl is really hard to pin down, it varies a lot from band to band and listener to listener. It's one of those things that's hard to define, but you know it when you hear a good one (assuming you're into that sort of thing, of course).
Some of my favourite growlers:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIXJFRVUdWo&feature=related
No John Tardy? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQgCZasm6mU
Also, @none, Hatebeak was hilarious. As far as pure novelty bands go it's great. I remember discovering them a long time ago. There was a similar band that did it with dogs if I remember right.
Murry Sparkles
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Quackula said:
No John Tardy? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQgCZasm6mU
Also, @none, Hatebeak was hilarious. As far as pure novelty bands go it's great. I remember discovering them a long time ago. There was a similar band that did it with dogs if I remember right.
I liked Obituary but i was never a big fan of them. Forgot about newer bands like Darkest Hour, try this growler gents.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_FnOlunWu1M&feature=fvwrel
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37WcvbjDRm8&feature=fvwrel
twooffour
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Quackula said:
Murry Sparkles said:
Quackula said:
Also, what makes a good growl is really hard to pin down, it varies a lot from band to band and listener to listener. It's one of those things that's hard to define, but you know it when you hear a good one (assuming you're into that sort of thing, of course).
Some of my favourite growlers:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIXJFRVUdWo&feature=related
No John Tardy? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NQgCZasm6mU
Also, @none, Hatebeak was hilarious. As far as pure novelty bands go it's great. I remember discovering them a long time ago. There was a similar band that did it with dogs if I remember right.
I've noticed something about these links, though: All of them growl on pitch in relation to the root. Sometimes it's on the 3rd, sometimes on the 5th, sometimes the root itself - the last link slides down from 5th to somewhere around the root; in another example, he begins at the 3rd and then slides down to the lower 5th. The only one I couldn't determine with certainty was the second link - although I kinda have the impression that he growled at the root pitch there... although sometimes I thought it was the major 3rd. Not sure. These examples do suggest, however, that good growling results from a "pleasant" timbre and fitting pitch.
Ziggy Stardust
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ChainsawAsh said:
David Bowie
quadrennia.tumblr.com
CP3S said:
You will not. None of us will, except for a very old and dying Ziggy Stardust who will watch it through teary eyes as he remembers us all.
pittrek said:
I seriously hope I will live enough to see the original Star Wars trilogy in this quality
twooffour
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Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda said:
twooffour said:
A question about jazz drums, doesn't the whole practising thing they've got going on with all the rudiments and technique, include being able to actually play evenly?That's an interesting question. Yeah, I certainly spent many years drilling those rudiments and how to apply them. Somewhere along the line, you learn to make them flow with the ups and downs of an improviser. The biggest problem I had playing rock was getting my bass drum to sound even. In a jazz group, the bass drum ranges from tiny nudges to explosive bombs, even in the same measure. In rock, the bass drum is so steady it can often just as well be synthesized and played on a pad. I just couldn't make my bass drum sound solid like that - if I didn't concentrate really hard, my bass drum would waver in volume. But a rock bass drum sound would be the fastest way to get yourself run out of a jazz group.
I know Buddy Rich's single strokes sound damn even and controlled ;)Yeah, Buddy was a freak of nature. Saw him several times and still wonder how on earth anyone could achieve that much facility. It's interesting to compare him with someone like Billy Higgins. Buddy could play circles around someone like that, but ask a jazz musician who they'd rather listen to.
Heh, yea, I get what you mean - you notice this kind of thing at the piano, where, at some point you've learned how to play a melody, or a scale "cantabile" and intuitively do crescendos and decrescendos and accents at the "fitting" notes and segments, and you realize you can't actually play the "even sewing machine".
Then again, same happens with tempo - if you get too used to applying rubato everywhere, you might realize one day you can't actually play in time.
But as far as I've heard, classical pianists often need to apply the "sewing machine" both in dynamics and tempo, let alone jazzers - so training that is kinda of necessary anyway ;)
Not sure if I can say I "prefer" Billy Higgins, especially since Buddy did his "quiet, tasty" solos as well.
As far as tasty, catchy, mind-blowing jazz drum solos, I probably prefer the kind of Joe Morello the most.
twooffour
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Hey, a question to those more versed in technical metal and the like - what do you think, if someone arranged the following piece for, say, guitar(s) and drumset:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uUwxRayWI4
... what that kind off pass off as metal? Just something I thought to myself.
It has the "harsh" percussive character, very little of what you could call "melody", the phrases (which often consist of mere chord progressions) kinda revolve around the root all the time, then there are the "breaks" and crazy time signature changes - I can literally some sort of crazy DB/toms build-up and then the guitar suddenly goes BEEP accompanied by a muted cymbal, at some specific passages ;)
(0:43 or 0:56)
Then at the end when he alludes to Twinkle Twinkle Little Star, it's almost like suddenly the keyboard tuned in with cheesy synth choirs and the song is heading for an "epic" finale... some of the "kinda more sophisticated" metal bands I've seen like to feature some sort of popular melody (like Hall of the Mountain King... which is classical, but has been a popcultural cliché for an eternity) or "classical sounding" chord progression like a quint fall sequence in the middle of their song... or at the end ;)
And then, the unexpected, abrupt ending! So metal :DD
Puggo - Jar Jar's Yoda
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legendary but little-known Jedi Mastertwooffour said:
Not sure if I can say I "prefer" Billy Higgins, especially since Buddy did his "quiet, tasty" solos as well.
As far as tasty, catchy, mind-blowing jazz drum solos, I probably prefer the kind of Joe Morello the most.
Higgins wasn't known for his soloing... I was mainly referring to how they each back up a group. As a drummer, I usually hate listening to drum solos :) And I don't like the sound of Buddy Rich's cymbals at all. Compare the sound of Tony Williams' kit on "Seven Steps to Heaven"... that ride cymbal is so musical it's is like a stradivarius. For loud drumming, Elvin Jones on the "A Love Supreme" album, or Art Blakey on the "Free For All" album, are the pinnacles of raw acoustic energy, in my opinion.
none
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Quackula wrote: There was a similar band that did it with dogs if I remember right.
Caninus: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vF7CB5yltbM&feature=related
And now for something completely bored.
-+------ RANK SINATRA ------+-
http://www.667u.com/rank%20sinatra.html
FunkyDays
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delurking mode.. on"In a controversy the instant we feel anger we have already ceased striving for the truth, and have begun striving for ourselves" - Shakyamuni Buddha
FunkyDays
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delurking mode.. onZiggy Stardust said:
ChainsawAsh said:
David Bowie
The man can spot an incredible guitar player from a mile away! He's ALWAYS had amazing players. I saw the Sound and Vision Tour years ago, and was thinking "no way is this guitarist gonna be as good as Mick Ronson"... it was Adrian Belew, and I ate my words first song into the show :-D
"In a controversy the instant we feel anger we have already ceased striving for the truth, and have begun striving for ourselves" - Shakyamuni Buddha
Ziggy Stardust
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I still have yet to go to a concert of his. :-(
quadrennia.tumblr.com
CP3S said:
You will not. None of us will, except for a very old and dying Ziggy Stardust who will watch it through teary eyes as he remembers us all.
pittrek said:
I seriously hope I will live enough to see the original Star Wars trilogy in this quality
what is everyones musical influence and any musicans here