generalfrevious said:

That's why SW cannot be the modern day Iliad. 

Or maybe because it's a simplistic action/adventure trilogy with relatively unsophisticated dialogue nothing like the kind found in Homer, Shakespeare or Goethe

generalfrevious said:

That's right. And it is more evident in the PT; hence the PT may (sadly) be GL's true vision, more than the original SW.

I was referring to the OT, you smart alec. The PT is not a modern day Iliad because it's a piece of excrement.

generalfrevious said:

I know that. I just said that the PT reinforced the flaws in the OT, rather than being just odd flukes of awfulness.

Yea, but point is, I don't get why choosing pretentious expressions like "modern day Iliad" could or should be valid at all when applied to SW.

No doubt the newer SW stuff along with the cartoons etc. somewhat sullied the popcultural reputation of "Star Wars", but it was never on par with "high literature" in the first place, esp. the hammy lyric kind.

The first film was a pulp space adventure film on par with Indiana Jones... can't it just stay in that category?

Darth Bizarro said:

There is a simple way past this whole problem.  Just ignore all the continuations and look at Star Wars as a stand alone movie.  Sure, Empire is good, but without the proper finale to live up to it, it all fell kinda flat.  Star Wars has a complete story from beginning to end and the only loose ends that get taken care of in the later movies are loose ends created by the later movies.  The only major loose end left unturned was the fact that Vader was still running around, but Vader was more or less just a big hit man guy in the first film.  Luke hasn't been trained to be a Jedi yet sure, but the full concept of what it even means to be a Jedi isn't really established until Empire.  And as far as the rebellion goes, in theory, the whole conflict could have been over right there at the end since the Death Star was really the only trump card the Empire had up it's sleeve to dismantle the Senate.  Remember that the guy said that is was impossible for the Emperor to maintain control without them, to which Tarken responds that it will be the fear of the Death Star that keeps them in line.  So no Death Star, no fear, no Tarken, no control. 

That's really awesome and all, but if you look at the title of this thread, the one thing that can be derived from your post is that if you take away Episodes V and VI, SW becomes even LESS of an "Iliad".

Those movies had all the "deep", "mature" stuff in Star Wars. The 1977 movie as itself is basically just a space pulp adventure film. A piece of tasteful entertainment both in content and delivery.

generalfrevious said:

ESB/TORJ made SW the masterpiece it was. It created an even richer world than the first movie (and that's saying a lot). IT might not be Homer, but it still is an irreplaceable fixture in our collective psyche.

Again, not saying those weren't great entertainment movies, it's just this wannabe snobbery that's getting on my nerves.

For some, Metallica is an irreplaceable piece in the puzzle of popular / rock music, or their musical and emotional experience - does anyone even NEED to say something like "it might not be Bach, but"?

Can't really say I consider the first SW movie a "rich world" - to me, it's basically a Flash Gordon movie that's grown up, but not quite. I don't see any psychological or philosophical depth anywhere in that movie - it's a pretty superficial, straightforward and wide-eyed adventure movie.

"Rich" in entertainment factor, basically.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQHtLDwShmY !!!!!!!!!

sexyloser said:

I'm sorry I couldn't reply sooner. But I just want to thank anybody that replied and to this site that allows Star War fans to vent their frustrations. To those saying that Homer or Shakespeare isn't a comparable example. Well maybe The Beatles or The Rolling Stones. My point is that I feel that Star Wars is an iconic piece of art that could potentially survive the far test of time.

It's sad that the stories I imagine in my mind is better, or at least more consistent, than whats shown on the big screen. The only way I can reconcile what I feel Star Wars should be and what it is, is to literally block out what I dislike out of my head and rewrite the blank spaces.  

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/FanonDiscontinuity

As probably a huge number of Star Wars fans had to do as evidenced by the large number of "Rewrite the Prequels" threads on other Star Wars forums. 

Well, Mendelssohn contributed a huge chunk of lot to J.S.Bach surviving the "far" test of time (after having been virtually forgotten and discarded as "old-fashioned" with the onset of (pre-)classicism), by basically single-handedly reviving his works on the concert stage.

Bach hadn't "ruined" or tainted his reputation by writing something shitty, and yet apparently he was in danger of staying obscure for a long, long time without active hands seeking to prevent that - my point being, if you want the OT to stand the "test of time" in spite of the prequels, you can work for that ;)

Which I think this site is all about :D