Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases :: 1 < 5 > 7

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msycamore's avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

SilverWook said:

I came across an interesting bit of history on Raider's original sound mix over at the LDDB forum, but I think you have to be registered there to be able to access it.

You mean this? http://forum.lddb.com/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=1296

"Raiders sound was mixed to be played in the VistaSonic Sound system that Paramount had previously used on Popeye and Dragonslayer. Unlike Dolby Stereo that used a matrix to encode 4 channels to 2 optical tracks, VistaSonic used 4 discrete optical tracks in the place of the normal 2. Since they were much smaller tracks, they were noisier, so a noise reduction system was used to improve fidelity. Stereo surrounds could also be employed by use of the SQ Quadraphonic matrix system - the stereo surrounds were encoded onto the Left and Right front channels with SQ - the discrete mono surround track then wasn't used. The playback head used a CCD based reader instead of a photodetector to keep the tracks and their phase response aligned better. The system was invented by Terry Beard who is also the inventor of the theatrical DTS system - while he owned NuOptix, a company that built much of the equipment used to record optical soundtracks, he also worked for Paramount's sound department as a technician in charge of research. There were many problems with VistaSonic during the Popeye and Dragonslayer showings (it had to be turned off during Popeye's premiere at the Chineese theater), so Raiders was switched to Dolby Stereo at the last minute - some minor remixing had to be done to accommodate the limitations of the Dolby logic decoding. The 70mm prints used the 4-track discrete VistaSonic mix unaltered except for the addition of Baby Boom subs. The DVD's 5.1 mix is the original VistaSonic mix so it's slightly different than the Dolby Stereo mix used on LaserDisc. The VistaSonic system was never used again - it had a nice logo though."

 

The plot thickens...

Last edited on June 27, 2012 at 5:03 PM by msycamore

We want you to be aware that we have no plans—now or in the future—to restore the earlier versions. 

Sincerely, Lynne Hale publicity@lucasfilm.com

captainsolo's avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

I just saw that press release and popped over here. That lddb quote is gold, and something that I've never heard of before. 4 optical tracks, or three with stereo surround matrixed sounds like an odd way to do things theatrically. That would answer why the film was mixed for stereo surround and then converted to Dolby Stereo.

Now I wonder what the '92 LD used if it's different.

VADER!? WHERE THE HELL IS MY MOCHA LATTE? -Palpy on a very bad day.

"George didn't think there was any future in dead Han toys."-Harrison Ford

My review blog: thehificelluloidmonster.wordpress.com

captainsolo's avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

It's a really interesting alternative for getting something closer to 70mm 6 track magnetic audio into conventional 35mm theaters. The thing is that they didn't think about the large noise associated with multiple optical tracks with no hiss reduction. Thus it was only used and abandoned for Popeye and Dragonslayer with them being reconditioned for Dolby Stereo. It must have had some kind of Paramount association, thus Raiders would be planned and mixed for the new format  but converted to Dolby Stereo for the main 35mm release.

VADER!? WHERE THE HELL IS MY MOCHA LATTE? -Palpy on a very bad day.

"George didn't think there was any future in dead Han toys."-Harrison Ford

My review blog: thehificelluloidmonster.wordpress.com

TServo2049's avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

Is the analog at least CX-encoded?

FWIW, LDDB lists these inner-circle mint marks for the remastered-sound release:

97-137A1-01   12D80846
97-137B3-04   14C80146

These "stealth" repressings are nuts. I'm worried how many we might have to get before we come up with a real digital-sound pressing. Almost makes it seem worth it to track down the expensive Japanese widescreen release...

Last edited on July 3, 2012 at 4:58 PM by TServo2049
borisanddoris' avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

It does sound good for analog alright!  I'm not entirely familiar with the film's mix, so I can't say how "correct" it is, but streaming to my Apple TV and decoding it into Pro-Logic II, it's wonderfully rich.  I did have to crank the fader way up to get a decent level though.  

"Alright twinkle-toes, what's your exit strategy?"

Trooperman's avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

It sounds wonderful on these hi-quality headphones.  Very warm sound.

Episode II: Shroud of the Dark Side

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TServo2049's avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

Wonderful, looking forward to it after your vacation (and after mine - I'm going up to Canada tomorrow, specifically BC/AB).

TServo2049's avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!</Vader>

Seriously, was not expecting that. It's as if some higher power doesn't want us to find the digital track...

TServo2049's avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

Sounds good.

Now I feel guilty for sending you on a wild goose chase for laserdiscs when you could have just gotten the VHS. :(

Erikstormtrooper's avatar
RE: Re-mixed audio tracks on video releases

SilverWook said:

Factory sealed or not, this tape is over a decade old.

A bit off topic, but why would a tape from the 90s not have macrovision?

You know of the rebellion against the Empire?

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